Lead painted staircase in terrace house 1902 - advice needed

[Fishwalker]

Hi,

I did a test for lead paint from B&Q and it went red straight away on the test site on my stair treads that I've been stripping with a hot air gun on low heat. Before I did the treads I stripped the strings of the staircase with only a disposable mask. I didn't know then about lead in old paint. Now I know it's there, I am in a serious fix. I've ripped all the stair carpet up and have bare stairs and have also tried chemical paint stripper but the hot gun works so much better and I really want to use that more. I don't have children in the house but have 2 cats. I've read loads on lead and how dangerous it is but I've lived here for 4 years now and paint has been flaky on door frames for all that time and I'm fine. I've sanded my front bedroom floor with hired floor sander and probably got lead dust in me then too and that was 2 years ago. I just don't know what to do from here as I can see what I want to do and yet all guidelines suggest getting professionals to do the work or go around like i'm in a radioactive environment with suit and plastic sheeting everywhere. I may seem flippant here but my boyfriend doesn't seem to care about the dangers and thinks i've overreacting so I want some advice from others who've come across this dilemma in their properties.

Re: the door frames, I could paint them again but the flaking is quite widely spread. Does anyone know whether its worth getting the whole frame taken out and my banisters replaced to get rid of some of the affected wood in my house and how much a pro would charge to do this? There is gloss painted wood everywhere e.g. dado rails, skirtings, door frames. A family with a baby lived her before us and they seemed fine.

Also if I buy a 28 day respirator and just lock my cats out of the affected rooms for a bit and clean up really well, will that be alright?

Pic's here:

https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/101320805064849039247/albums/5662257450895011057

 

[ic1927]

Seriously, put the hot air gun away, using this produces noxious fumes that will damage your health, and for Gods sake don't dry sand lead paint. Chemical stripping is the safe way to remove lead paint, it may take a bit longer but what's more important than your health?.

 

[Nige F]

How toxic are the fumes from stripper ? - Wet sand the paint that`s staying - and crack on with the air gun to remove the paint that`s going - just open all the windows and let the wind blow through - This lead scare lark is worse than asbestos . We`ve all injested more lead from traffic fumes before they banned it in petrol

 

[elrobbo82]

How toxic are the fumes from stripper ? - Wet sand the paint that`s staying - and crack on with the air gun to remove the paint that`s going - just open all the windows and let the wind blow through - This lead scare lark is worse than asbestos . We`ve all injested more lead from traffic fumes before they banned it in petrol

are you saying that because you might have breathed some lead in the past that it is perfectly alright to contaminate yourself more? also do you think that the asbestos related diseases are a SCARE? look if you had electric shocks in the past i take it that you would quite happily grab bare live cables as this seems like your logic. please don't tell people to do something thing that is very hazardous just because you do not value your health.

 

[ic1927]

How toxic are the fumes from stripper ? - Wet sand the paint that`s staying - and crack on with the air gun to remove the paint that`s going - just open all the windows and let the wind blow through - This lead scare lark is worse than asbestos . We`ve all injested more lead from traffic fumes before they banned it in petrol

a solvent-based or caustic paint stripper does not produce any fumes, you can verify this on the Directgov website, under safe removal of lead paint.

 

[dcdec]

Easiest way to deal with it is replace what you can such as skirtings and architraves and make good the other stuff.

I really dont understand the british obsession with stripping paint, in 10 + years as a pro decorator i have rarely felt the need to remove coatings, loose and flaky paint will always come off with scraping and abrading, its then just a case of priming and filling. In your case where you cant replace you should wet abrade to avoid the dust from lead based paint.

I kinda get Nige F's point of view there's alot of H&S blollocks about and short term exposure may do you no harm but lead builds up in the system, none of us know what other exposure you may have had through your life or if you live in a polluted city or a country village, smoker or non smoker etc so only you can make the decision, my advice would be to play it safe.

 

[misterhelpful]

There are valid points made by all in this thread and I will throw my hat into the chemical stripper side of them. It is the safer, if somewhat tiresome option (especially now that the best strippers have been weakened ) but is the best way to go if you are intent on full removal.

There is some scope for the use of a heat gun on lead paint if you can set the gun below 450°C . This will allow the paint to be softened without burning and thus not releasing the fumes. However, in practice it is difficult, as the paint won't always soften adequately enough to be removed, but even if it does, you need to clear the stripped paint before it re-hardens (causing harmful dust when you then clear it) whilst also keeping the area being stripped soft.

As dcdec suggests, in most cases there is no real the need to remove all paint and his thoughts on making good the existing are valid. If you can't/don't want to do this then chemical stripper is the best way to go.

H&S gone mad, maybe, but I'd rather be safe than sorry. As stated, it's your choice.

 

[TheDec]

Years ago we used to burn it off with blow lamp because we didn't know any better, but now I would never advise anyone to even attempt it.

Dec

 

[elrobbo82]

look at asbestos now and think of all the problems that it has caused. years ago plumbers were mixing this stuff up with no masks for pipe lagging. no one was aware. lead is also very hazardous and too should be handled with caution. i'm with thedec on this one and always treat with care. you can not put a price on your own health and that of your family!!!

lead is toxic and can be fatal so safe working practices are a must!!!

 

[TheDec]

Agree,

An absolute must.

Dec

 

[Fishwalker]

Hi and thanks for the useful feedback all of you! I didn't expect such a response but I hope this will be a useful thread for other people who are looking for info on removing lead paint too, so any more opinions would be great from people with experience of this.

I do value my health of course, and that of people entering my home, which is exactly why I've been doing all this research and have not really touched the wood, since last using the chemical stripper, last week.

When I did, I pasted the stuff on the stair treads at the top of the stairs and used this Wilko's own brand stuff, that looks like a whitish coloured gel, over which I laid cling-film and then newspaper and left it for a couple of days to get the maximum effect.

When I lifted it, I found the top layer of paint came off quite well with a scraper and was still nice and moist, but the primer was stuck still underneath and at that point I put on my lead fume safe disposable mask from B&Q (cost £5.78ish) and goggles + gloves and used the hot air gun on lowest heat, so 400oC according to the spec, of which you can see it in this link and also see the reviews I read, which are why I bought it e.g. the one from someone else with an old house who seems to have not known about lead paint either (http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=10487558).

The air gun did set my smoke alarm off a couple of times though. Once when first used, which I assume was as it was new and another time when I came home and my boyfriend was using it on the stair strings (before I knew of the lead dangers). So fumes are a concern and the smell when using the gun is pretty nasty for a half hour or so after use but i've never seen any smoke when using it. The paint softens and then bubbles slightly and then scrapes right off, pretty much all layers, so it is really effective, if it wasn't for the lead! I haven't burnt any paint at any point. It dries hard again after cooling and I just dustpan and brush it up after spraying with a bit of water and bag it. I've also used my HEPA vacuum cleaner after wiping the wood down with a damp sponge. I hope this is ok.

The advice on dealing with existing flaking doorways is useful. I thought myself, if I could wet sand it and fill and paint over, that would be the easiest way forward, as the wood is just everywhere! Pulling the frames out, for which i'd have to get a pro in for, would surely cause loads of lead dust anyway and for a house that is really an ex student house in a student area which I don't intend to stay in for more than a couple of years more in theory, I don't really want to go into full on renovation but I don't want to bodge job either if I can help it.

 

[joe-90]

Everyone panics about lead - and then gets the fags out.

Tobacco kills 50% of those that breath the fumes so compare that with lead.

Who in this thread smokes?

 

[misterhelpful]

I put on my lead fume safe disposable mask from B&Q (cost £5.78ish) and goggles + gloves and used the hot air gun on lowest heat, so 400oC according to the spec...
The paint softens and then bubbles slightly and then scrapes right off, pretty much all layers, so it is really effective, if it wasn't for the lead! I haven't burnt any paint at any point. It dries hard again after cooling and I just dustpan and brush it up after spraying with a bit of water and bag it. I've also used my HEPA vacuum cleaner after wiping the wood down with a damp sponge. I hope this is ok.

Well you've done everything the recommended way with the heat gun method so there shouldn't be too much to worry about up to now but, as we've pretty much all said, the chemical method is by far the safest way to continue.

I've not used the Wilko stripper myself and tend to stick to NitroMors (not what it used to be though) for the little stripping I do. You might want to try PeelAway/Stripaway but it is pretty expensive.

EDIT: Not me, joe.

 

[TheDec]

Everyone panics about lead - and then gets the fags out.

Tobacco kills 50% of those that breath the fumes so compare that with lead.

Who in this thread smokes?

I suppose the only time that I have ever smoked is when as a kid trying to light the bonfire I caught my my shoe on fire, as far as fags are concerned, never touched them.

Dec

 

[Nige F]

Hi and thanks for the useful feedback all of you! The advice on dealing with existing flaking doorways is useful. I thought myself, if I could wet sand it and fill and paint over, that would be the easiest way forward, .

Using different grades of wet+dry paper well rinsed to prevent clogging will be fine - Just like my grandfather did with a pumice stone and water when he was a painter`s apprentice - also they mixed their own paint and ground the ingredients including the white lead . When I knew him he didn`t smoke , because he got TB in his 30`s . So living to 80 wasn`t bad having worked with lead paint As to liquid stripper - I was thinking Nitromors etc. like a furniture restorer M8 uses - I won`t go in his workshop when that stuff is out