New C/H system - recommendations

[bernardgreen]

would you ask a garage to fit points and a distributor cap when you know fuel injection is available

That would depend on where I was going to drive the car. Breaking down with a computor controlled engine where there is no support for that make and model would be a disaster. Breaking down with a ignition coil, points and distributor is not a problem if there are spares in the boot and the driver has basic knowledge and skills to replace them.

 

[picasso]

So you would buy a new car with 30 year old technology under the bonnet because you might be able to fix it if it broke down ? I can see where the alternative thinking in coming into play.

 

[Agile]

Sounds like those RGIs who swear by the Ideal Classic!

 

[bernardgreen]

So you would buy a new car with 30 year old technology under the bonnet because you might be able to fix it if it broke down ?

Not if I was never going to be beyond the range of a reliable break down service.

I am now very unlikely to go that far from civilisation that I could be a position to have to carry out DIY repairs to a car at the roadside.

Some redundant ambulances were donated to third world countries, one condition was they had to be road side repairable without any need for specialist tools and equipment.

 

[picasso]

There are lots of plumbers able to install and service unvented systems so your argument does not really make sense.

 

[Dan Robinson]

He also ignores the fact that vented systems need maintenance and checks.

He also ignores the premises on which advise is given or the fact that professionals will work through the options in order of suitability and best end result.

Bernard has neither the knowledge or experience to think of all the options despite his pompous claims of alternative thinking, which are frankly, laughable.

Claiming sarcasm after the fact doesn't wash with those of us that know perfectly well, that you only came back with the idea of an accumulator after a bit of frantic googling to see if you could think of something outside the box.

 

[picasso]

So whats wrong with brushing your teeth with water that has a few feathers in it ? at least if your hot water system breaks down you will be able to fix it .......wont you ?

 

[Agile]

I am now very unlikely to go that far from civilisation that I could be a position to have to carry out DIY repairs to a car at the roadside.

I became stuck in a blizzard on a Turkish road over a mountain and during the night the engine froze up. It pushed the core plugs out and cracked the water pump casting.

I was able to hammer the core plugs back and repair the water pump with what I had with me. It lasted fine until I got back to the UK.

 

[slippyr4]

My dad had an unvented cylinder installed this week. I'l' have to tell him that he was wrong to opt for that. We'll get the plumber who wrongly advised us back in to rip it out.

He'll be disappointed though, he thought that the removal of the liability of having 50 gallons of water in the roof, along with the higher hot water pressure & better thermal efficiency, was a benefit.

Maybe when he sells the cylinder for scrap he'll have enough money to buy an old banger of a motor with points ignition.

 

[Roger928]

I have two cold water cisterns in the loft. Serving separate parts of the house.
The plumber preferred the second one and I already was of that opinion also. Would have done the installation myself but unable due to injury. For me it was the right choice and the plumber agreeing confirmed that.
Even though I have 25/lmin@1 bar dynamic.

I had a joiner deck out the relevant area for access and safety and left it as convenient as possible for him.
It does seem archaic but its very reliable.

The brother in law is a house builder and prefers gravity systems in some cases where upgrading the mains is not an option. One being a large new build of his own that he rents out.

That said I plumbed a large 2 storey about 10 years ago and recently finished the loft extension. 6 bedrooms now.
All unvented. The mains was upgraded from the road to the property with 150m of 32mm mdpe and serves 4 ensuites, a main bathroom and downstairs toilet and shower room. The kitchen and the utility room with washing machine and Belfast sink.

Horses for courses, swings and round abouts etc.

 

[bernardgreen]

He also ignores the fact that vented systems need maintenance and checks.

Yes but there are fewer "moving parts" in a vented system to be maintained and routinely inspected.
Moving part in the storage tank is a ball valve, if it fails water coming out of the overflow indicates the failure
Moving part in non vented cylinder is the pressure relief valve. What indications are there if that fails to "move" when it should open due to over pressure ?

He also ignores the premises on which advise is given or the fact that professionals will work through the options in order of suitability and best end result.

Is that the best end result for the customer or best end result for the installer. I accept that the majority of installers will consider the customer's requirements but some less ethical installers do groom the customer to require a system more suited to the installer's benefit.

Claiming sarcasm after the fact doesn't wash with those of us that know perfectly well, that you only came back with the idea of an accumulator after a bit of frantic googling to see if you could think of something outside the box.

I did not have to google to know about accumulators, many posts on this forum praise them as the perfect solution to low flow rates on the incoming mains. Shame they are not the perfect solution.

A discusion on another forum last year considered accumulators to be the same as a dead leg in the pipe work and not suitable for use on drinking water supplies. Quotes from (IIRC) a Department of Health Technical Memorandum ( that forum is not accessible to google or any other search bots )

Dead-leg – a length of water system pipework leading to a fitting through which water only passes infrequently when there is draw off from the fitting, providing the potential for stagnation.

Note: any arrangements designed-in should ensure there are no areas where water can stagnate (for example, dead-legs).

Maybe accumulators are designed and constructed in a way that ensures stagnation does not happen in the water stored in the accumulator.

So whats wrong with brushing your teeth with water that has a few feathers in it ?

If there are feathers in the water then the installation is wrong in that the tank ( cistern ) does not have a suitable lid fitted to it.

 

[Steelmasons]

Dead-leg?..you're obviously not familiar with the way in which an accumulator functions..
I guess 50 gallons of stored water which can exceed temperatures of 30c is ok then??

 

[bernardgreen]

Dead-leg?..you're obviously not familiar with the way in which an accumulator functions..

Obviously not, care to explain how they work. Do they have two ports, one in and one out, or is it a single port for both in and out.

I guess 50 gallons of stored water which can exceed temperatures of 30c is ok then??

bad guess, unless WRAS have got it wrong. As mentioned earlier in this thread WRAS consider water supplied from a properly installed cold water storage cistern can considered as being wholesome ( assuming of course the supply to the cistern was wholesome )

 

[Dan Robinson]

Google is not your friend Bernard. And those of us with customers of 30 years + must be doing something right.

Your pomposity and arrogance are almost as astounding as your ignorance.

 

[bernardgreen]

Google is not your friend Bernard.

Google is a search engine, it in itself does not provide information. What it does do is to help locate documents and other sources of accurate information from reputable professional sources. It does of course also locate documents that are full of inaccurate information, some of which, such as marketing material, is intentionally misleading.

Various other on line data retrieval systems are available. these are not available to the general public and are intended for accademic and commercial research activity.

Your pomposity and arrogance are almost as astounding as your ignorance.

Overt and justified self confidence is often mistaken for arrogance.