Permitted Development

[^woody^]

Didn't someone post a picture of a hideous loft extension recently/past few months?

 

[^woody^]

People - and particularly children - should not be forced to live in small houses with rabbit-hutch sized rooms

Every single pre and post war three-bed semi with a box room then?

What's wrong with all those kids now?

 

[John D v2.0]

I think living has changed a lot from 50 years ago partly in terms of modern living and partly in terms of population density and distribution. I don't think anyone thinks loft conversions and extensions really improve the quality of space in and around it other than in terms of physical size.

I think the preferred option for planners in outskirts is probably to demolish all the suburban semis and replace with something a bit taller and a better use of space for people. Everyone could have a lot more internal space plus there could be better quality shared space outside with better segregation of space for cars and people/parks.

In terms of danger, yes as mentioned above, planning permission has nothing to do with danger, that's building regulations.

Edit: and Mr Bucks is going to regret posting on here as none of us have given the right "mail" story!

 

[blup]

.

 

[Leofric]

Everybody wants more space , but surely that doesn't mean they should be allowed to build anything that suits them

 

[securespark]

https://peter-reynolds.co.uk/tag/jonathan-bucks/

 

[geraldthehamster]

If this is for the Mail, can we help them to find a way to blame Muslims, foreigners or gay people?

 

[Leofric]

Thought this was a DIY forum

 

[oculushut]

Neighbours can disagree with the larger extensions. If they disagree the planning department then goes back to normal planning rules. Bit of a joke really as it just forces you back down the complex, expensive, long and unpredictable planning application process which seems to have created an industry that pushes paper around a Kafkaesque bureaucracy...

Us: "Does this drawing and idea look OK?"

Planning-bot: "Please fill out the form... we cannot provide you with any advice unless you pay us..."

Us: "Here have some cash for pre-advice and here is what we are thinking - what do you think?"

Planning-bot: "Please wait 8 weeks for our response now you have paid us..."

8 weeks later...

Planning-bot: "The answer is MAYBE and you should fill out the real planning form to get a real answer..."

Us: "If we make this bit lower then would that work?"

Planning-bot: "Please fill out the form... we cannot provide you with any advice unless you pay us..."

Pay for an architect... fill in the forms and submit something smaller...

Planning-bot: "No - it's too big and creates a tunnelling effect for your neighbour"

Us + Architects: "What if we make it a bit smaller here and there?"

Planning-bot: "Please fill out the form... we cannot provide you with any advice unless you pay us..."

Pay for architect... to make side return a bit shorter and lower height... submit after a couple weeks + 8 weeks waiting for planning-bot...

Planning-bot: "No - it's too big and creates a tunnelling effect for your neighbour"

Us + Architects: "What if we make it a bit smaller here and there?"

Planning-bot: "Please fill out the form... we cannot provide you with any advice unless you pay us..."


We submit an appeal, but this also gets rejected, but provides little in the way of actual concrete and useful advice - "don't bother"... or "make this bit shorter" would have been useful.

We then decide to use permitted development to test the rules since this was free and there was no way to actually have a conversation with the planning department... submit a bunch of different applications from max permitted development size for terraced (6m) down to 3m + a bit and various heights (below 3m). Neighbour objects to all of them so they are tested based on normal planning rules.

After many more months...

They are ALL rejected.

We are now going to just build a 3m side return.

Would have been helpful if they just told us that they would not accept anything longer than 3m in our place. Would have saved a lot of time and money!

 

[Leofric]

Neighbours can disagree with the larger extensions.

Are you saying neighbours can overrule permitted development rights ?

 

[tony1851]

Are you saying neighbours can overrule permitted development rights ?

Neighbours cannot 'overrule' permitted development rights; as long as an extension falls within the parameters set by the legislation, neither neighbours nor the council can prevent the work.

However, the concession for 6m/8m extensions under the neighbour consultation scheme is a 'half-way' house. If no neighbour objects within the 21-day notification period, the extension does not require approval from the council and can go ahead; this applies even if the council does not like it and would reject it if it was submitted as a formal planning application.

If any neighbour does complain, then the council must look at the proposal in terms of the affect on amentity of the neighbours. If the council decides that there is no detriment to adjoining properties, then the work can go ahead. If the council decides that there is an impact on amenity, then it will ask for a formal planning application (and would probably refuse it).

The system is unfair to the extent that two identical extensions can be proposed along a row of houses in one road, and one be allowed, while one is not allowed, depending on the attitude of neighbours.

 

[Leofric]

Neighbours cannot 'overrule' permitted development rights

Yes , I understand now , I was overlooking the neighbour consultation scheme for the large extensions that oculushut did rightly mention. These current permitted development rights and neighbour consultation scheme are ridiculous in my opinion.

 

[Nakajo]

@Leofric Why do you consider these to be ridiculous?

 

[Leofric]

For a start allowing an 8m extension without planning permission doesn't take much account of the appearance of such an extension. The hip to gable rules allow any sort of unsightly roof extension. It all just goes against the purpose of planning in my opinion which should be to control the appearance and suitability of buildings in their surroundings.
As an architectural technician who has spent most of my life preparing drawings and obtaining planning and building regulations approvals for people and working to the rules it just seems wrong that the 'rules' are now being abandoned allowing any sort of thing, as far as house extensions are concerned ,to be built. I have had to apply for planning permission for conservatories in the past for god's sake .
I could go on but that is enough for now.
Regards