Peugeot valve clearances?

[Agile]

Yesterday it was quite mild, about 17 C so I thought a good chance to test car again.

I hand pumped but only 1/2 squeeze needed. Just used the built in preheat on the plugs.

With the warm day it fired every time but only ran for 2-5 seconds at idling speed. It took five goes to get it to carry on running!

This makes me think that it is a fuel starvation problem! But why only when starting from cold and fine for the rest of the day?

I will try opening an injector connector as suggested but I dont see what could cause this problem just at first start in the day.

I have not looked in the fuel filter yet but can anyone imagine any way that could cause starting problems only when cold?

What does a little water in the fuel do? Does it collect nicely in the filter? I seem to remember commercial systems can have a drain plug on the bottom!

Tony

 

[Mursal]

Hopefully taking in air or making air overnight. If the fuel is allowed to run back into the tank air will form in the pipe, even though there isn't a leak to the outside world. Try opening the supply pipe to the injector pump and priming before a start. Also, try using the primer when it starts, might take two people
Patience required, but cheaper than compression rings, only to find it still wont start!!

When changing the filter be skeptical to the condition of all the seals and copper washers

I'm not sure where the fuel lift pump is on that Peugeot? Some of the other members will know, might be electric on the tank, or is it mechanical on the engine?

Good luck

 

[Burnerman]

Try changing the fuel filter...even if its clean there's a chance to put new seals in.
Early models used either a Bosch or Lucas CAV filter in a separate canister...yours may well be bolted to the front of the cylinder block. Post a picture if you're not certain.
Diesel engine fuel lines run at negative pressure, so its dead easy to suck air in, without letting fuel out......this engine relies on the injector pump to lift fuel from the tank.
The reason that its ok for the rest of the day is because the air has been purged out.....but if the car was left long enough, then the same symptoms would occur.
John

 

[Agile]

But if there was air in the pump/fuel lines then wouldn't the priming pump be soft at startup?

And why would it be so temperature dependent?

The fuel filter is nicely situated on RH side of engine so easy to get at!

I will have a look on Sun/Mon

Thanks

Tony

 

[mysteryman]

The starter needs to turn the engine over very smartly for a cold start. No doubt you've checked that. Otherwise, as you say, fuel starvation, possibly leaking into the suction pipe from the tank when it's running, and bubbles gathering when you stop it.

I've had nothing but Peugeot/Citroen diesels [with one exception] since 1985, and they've all been good, apart from an '03 Berlingo, which had quite a lot of parts, including a new starter!

 

[Agile]

Yes, I am pretty sure its some kind of fuel starvation now.

But so odd because one started for the rest of the day it starts fine just like any car!

On Saturday I got my friend to continuously pump the primer as I was starting it and it fired up every time although died a few seconds later but started OK on the fifth attempt.

Tony

 

[Burnerman]

When you change the fuel filter, try to leave the water bleed off screw at the bottom of the filter bowl alone....in my experience they can allow a small quantity of air through once disturbed.
I rarely find any water in the fuel anyway!
Lube any gaskets / 'o' rings etc as the filter assembly is rebuilt.
One thing - about being slightly off beam on this topic - fuel delivery problems aren't temperature dependant, but they are time dependant.
John

 

[libby lou lou]

Is the filter housing the type you pump with the heel of you hand?

These type are bad for air leaks without leaving any traces of diesel,used to be temporarily fixed by putting a plastic bag over the top.

 

[Agile]

Filter is standard bowl type with a seperate in line priming bulb!
There does not seem to be an obvious water drain point but I have not taken it out yet.

 

[libby lou lou]

Air is getting in as mentioned ,try see through pipe and check for bubbles.

come on your a boiler engineer are you not?

 

[Agile]

Still have the lack of power problem!

Spoke to someone at a back garage with overalls with Lxx Bxxxxx Diesels!

He could not recognise the running engine as a diesel which did not bode well!

I explained the problem to him and he suggested it could be the injectors and that I should ( pay them ) to remove and test them.

Does anyone think a problem on the engine could really be caused by all injectors being at fault? Since it does not run roughly and still does 55 mph that seems less likely to me!

Tony

 

[Burnerman]

If the injectors have a faulty spray pattern due to fouling / age etc then they could well benefit from a clean.
However, there would always be other symptoms including smoke, poor starting and engine knocking.
I don't think they are a problem in your case, but the odd dose of a sustance such as Millers Diesel clean does no harm. Forte do a similar product.
John

 

[Agile]

There was a mistake in my previous posting!

The car does about 55 MPG which is normal for that model so I see that fact as a diagnostic aspect to ensure fuel is not being wasted by wrong mix etc.

The car will do about 75 on the flat ( eventually )! Starts OK and no smoke on start up or subsequently.

The worst aspect is the lack of power at about 1500-2500 rpm which means it can only manage about 40 mph on a motorway hill whereas it should do about 70. Also very slow to accelerate from 30-50 mph.

Could that really be due to an injector problem affecting all four injectors?

Are they difficult to remove?

Tony

 

[Burnerman]

Ideally, each injector should be removed (they are screwed in, and often ferociously tight) and then tested by a specialist. That person will check the spray pattern, lift pressure and shut off (so there's no dribble).
Your injectors aren't electronically controlled - they just open when the fuel pressure is highest.
If the injector spray pattern is poor, the engine will smoke as the fuel droplets aren't being atomised....this will hinder starting too, especially in the winter.
Personally I don't expect injector issues here, but I would expect a problem with the injector pump timing. Tell me - has this been checked at all?
I presume by now, the air cleaner is new, and there's no obstructions in either the air inlet pipe, or the exhaust system - both of which will nicely strangle any engine.
John

 

[Agile]

Since there is no smoke and the fuel consumption is correct and good at 55 mpg I dont suspect any injector problem.

Annoyingly the exhaust downpipe broke a couple of days ago but this gave an opportunity to see what if any difference it made to the performance. There was no difference!

The air cleaner is new.

I also have wondered about a timing problem. It does rather feel like a petrol engine with retarded ignition! How can that be checked and adjusted?

The cam belt was renewed about 15k ago. Is there a possibility that it could have been replaced with the injector pump wrongly set? Is there a hole to line up a peg at tdc?

Whoever replaced the cambelt did write the date on the cover with silver paint that makes it look like a conscientious job! But....

Tony