Plumbing course

[Redhotferrari]

Gasglider, you sound sceptical...........

If thsats the case how come my brother in law recently had a system boiler replaced, near enough straight swap bar a little bit of pipe movement near the boiler and I mean a LITTLE bit, top whack for for boiler £700.00, invoice cost £1800.00 pluss vodka and tonic, in and out in less that a day

Dont sound like a bad aday day in the office to me

Before you say it, yeah, yeah I know less tax, overheads, quoting job, paying for holiday in carribian etc..............................................................................................

Dont get me wrong, fair play

 

[oilman]

seems that all Plumers have got it in for the high number of newcomers to the game. Can't blame ya like but it's a big wide world we live in and there is plenty of work out there if you keep digging.

You haven't got the point. You asked about an expensive course, what you've been told is it's a waste of money. You don't need a course, just start doing work you know you can do, then gradually add to it, and don't overstretch your abilities, and don't lie about your experience. Honesty works, except when you get a dishonest customer, and they exist in larger numbers than dishonest tradesmen.

 

[gasglider]

Gasglider, you sound sceptical...........

If thsats the case how come my brother in law recently had a system boiler replaced, near enough straight swap bar a little bit of pipe movement near the boiler and I mean a LITTLE bit, top whack for for boiler £700.00, invoice cost £1800.00 pluss vodka and tonic, in and out in less that a day

Dont sound like a bad aday day in the office to me

Before you say it, yeah, yeah I know less tax, overheads, quoting job, paying for holiday in carribian etc..............................................................................................

Dont get me wrong, fair play

I am not sceptical, I know that sort of money can be earned, but not in my neck of the woods.

If they were in and out in a day, how many installers were there? did the system get flushed out & commissioned properly?

Usually takes me 2 days on my own for a straight swop, extra trv's, new room stat etc. There might be £600 on the job - there might be more or less than that, but I have yet to do £600 a day on ANY sort of gas work.

 

[Redhotferrari]

Location Oxfordshire if that makes a difference?

House was only about 7 years old, so TRV's etc all good and in place, litterally changed knackered boiler for a new one....they flushed the system etc.

Not sure if there was one or two installers but even with two, a damn tidy days money all the same

 

[Redhotferrari]

just to confirm, new system boiler, flue, one installer, flush etc, but no new TRV's or stats, these are were not needed

 

[jjfresh66]

Anyway to close this thread - I just want to thank everyone for the advise and support. A different array of answers to ponder about.
Gasglider - Thanks for your bit i appreciate this especially - Wouldn't mind getting a little more info from yourself but not through Diynot.

Cheers

 

[Nige F]

Evening all,




Rich.

so £9500 divided by £600 a day changing boilers =16 jobs as a Corgi you should pay the bank back in 6 months ....Forget bathrooms, drains, roofing,commercial pipework guttering, sitework.....just be a Domesticated Corgi

IT IS FACT...I know I`m stirring , but I don`t make up the ££££.. It was a friend who said "can you just" on a old/new wall boiler swap. I`d pre-corgi done the original in the house . Said NO...no benchmark , hips etc. Our honesty cost him £600 labour Better still, others the same price . word of mouth . And Which? Consumers mag. pretty much agree that a boiler swap is £1600 to £4000 inclusive C`mon Corgis . Hiding in the Kenne£ are you That system didn`t need a flush. Because I`d done it and dosed with inhibitor when I`d installed it originaly . all the quotes were similar

 

[Goldspoon]

Hi,

My first post here but have been reading posts for a few months now. It's a long one and I apologise in advance for this but may be useful to person who asked about courses.

On Nov 5th 2007 I started a plumbing course with Reactfast in Birmingham and completed it 7 weeks later on 21st December (cost about £5,500). Course itself was excellent, intensive and qualifications received were:

City and Guilds 6022 (copper work) and 6032 (bathroom design/fitting)
BPEC Water Regulations
Energy and Efficiency Part L
Part P Limited Scope Electrical

I also bought a van and fitted it out with tools and stock etc.

As you can see, there is no going back for me.

Prior to Nov 5th I new nothing about plumbing... I mean absolutely nothing at all... most I had done was to bleed a radiator. My previous job was in IT (website development). For various reasons I needed a change - and it had to be nothing to do with PC's.

Finished the course 21st December and started first job for a friend of my wife on 8th January - the job is a complete bathroom refit in bungalow: old bath/basin/WC ripped out and new fitted. For me this was a daunting project and, to be honest, I was apprehensive. To complicate things for me the bath to be moved from one end of the room to the other. Also required shower to be moved from one end of room to other/radiator to be moved from one side of room to other/all old tiles removed and new tiling to be completed. I had never tiled in my life. Added later: Oh... and please could I move a radiator in the spare room from one wall to another.

Nine working days later (taking my time) and I have completed the following:

- Switched off combi and drained all rads
- Removed old rad and fitted new rad in bathroom, routing pipework up through ceiling and across loft to primary pipes (I used plastic in loft and 10mm copper to rad).
- Moved rad in spare bathroom (cut old pipes and extended to next wall).
- I noted boiler was on 0.4 pressure when I first arrived rather than 1.5 and that it had not been serviced for 7 years. Also when I tried to refill the filling loop water poured from it, not from fittings but from pipe. Recommended boiler be serviced by Corgi chap and he came same day and also replaced filling loop.
- Re-filled primary circuit and bled radiators and used bleed screws in loft. Rads working perfectly.
- Removed all tiles and flatted wall with sander.
- Fitted new bath
- Removed old mixer shower (pipes cut and sealed in loft).
- Removed old WC and fitted new one (brass screws into concrete floor).
- Tiled two walls with large wall tiles (A4 size approx.) and this included around bath (I have never tiled before but read a book/watched Topps Tiles video and chatted to shop staff... all seems okay!).

I have still to do: fit basin/fit shower/small tiles around basin

I have fitted iso valves to all places required. Most work is end feed.

Husband of woman has asked me to visit his place when I have finished because his rads are all luke warm. Using info from course/this forum/books I am sure I can see what's what.

Off to look at another job next week (another friend of my wife).

I cannot tell you that a course is worthwhile or not (ask me again in a year!). However I 'believe' that if you are a "get up and go" person who is willing to read and research your subject and who is prepared to put the time and effort in then it is possible to start a new life as a plumber and make reasonable or good money at it. As somebody said - start with what you know and add more complicated things as your experience develops. I will start by doing jobs for family and friends if possible, charging mediocre rates (I am not charging much for the bathroom job - £500 - as I view it as much for my "learning" advantage as the customer - but the extra spare room rad move I charged at £25 an hour and it took 4 hours).

Already I think I can see how referrals will work - "my" bathroom project will be seen by all the friends of the customer and she has already said she will pass my details on.

Where I feel rather weak in experience is:

- Central heating systems: although covered in detail on the course in a classroom setting there was not much "hands on". Pumps, valves and room stats still feel rather mysterious to me (not for long though as I will be hunting them down).
- Building tasks: ripping up floorboards/drilling through walls and ceilings/boxing in pipoework etc.: having to learn along the way
- Replacing stop cock - never done
- Outside mains tap in street: never seen one

The Reactfast course is actually designed for their new franchaise owners and it is mostly emergency callouts (Reactfast operate a plumbing franchaise and are one of the 100 Virgin fastest growing companies). People go on the course and are then quickly on the road with a van (with phone support). Apparently this works fine so the training must be doing its job. I met one guy who finished the course a year ago and he said he was fully busy, 40 hours a week, after 6 months. After a year he had more work than he could deal with so turned work down. The next day he was fitting a boiler as he had teamed up with a Corgi guy. He was very happy with what he was earning and happy he was his own boss.

I am sure that there are those that have done courses and it has not worked out... it would be interesting to hear from them. One of the trainers at Reactfast reckoned that 50% are busy plumbers a year after the course and the other 50% were doing something else (off the cuff conversation so cannot rely on figures). He also said that some were earning very good money and some were employing other plumbers and even sending newbies on the course themselves. One guy moved into fitting underground geo thermal piping systems (something like that) whilst another now specialises in solar panels.

As I said it is very early days for me. I intend to pass my business cards to everybody I know and advertise in a local paper (my wife spoke to somebody who went on a course and started to advertise in a local paper - apparently they took the ad out after a few weeks as too much work).

As I said... ask me again in a year (but failure is not an option).

 

[sooey]

O. M. G.

 

[gasglider]

Location Oxfordshire if that makes a difference?

House was only about 7 years old, so TRV's etc all good and in place, litterally changed knackered boiler for a new one....they flushed the system etc.

Not sure if there was one or two installers but even with two, a damn tidy days money all the same

All sounds fair to me, but those prices may be the going rate in Oxfordshire, however, here in South Yorks (Doncaster to be precise), it is usually price that wins out when the quotes go in, and there is usually someone who will do it cheaper. Consequently, if you want the job, you need to price accordingley.

80% of the boiler change systems I see are dirty, as they were originally back boiler systems with Primatic cylinders, or suffer from the cheap combi merchants who fitted cheap boilers, filled them up with tap water and left the building. - No cold flush, no warm flush, no X400, no final flush and fill with inhibitor.
So I generally put a cleanser in the system a week or two before I do the actual boiler change, and then do all the above during my second day on the job. This nearly always sorts out the system, and if I still have any doubt I will fit a magnaclean to pick up the remnants of sludge stiil left in the system.

Nige F - I didn't say you were stirring, or didn't disbelieve what you said - I have done enough work in the South to know that things are different to where I now do most of my work. - I also know that I can charge more for what I do when I work in Leeds, because there is more affluence than there is in Doncaster. But at 47 years of age, with a back that is fast giving up the ghost, I tend to take my time a bit more than I used to, and concentrate on the work that pays best for the least effort !
The only people around here who can charge £4000 for a boiler change and get away with it are BG. There are some decent larger specialist heating companies that come in at around £2.5 - £3 k, but most of the independants (decent ones) would be charging anywhere between £1500 - £3000 dependig on boiler, extras etc.

Goldspoon - you sound like a diamond ! stick at it, get your experience level up, and you will be allright, and when you feel confident enough, get your ACS done so you can do Gas work as well. The only thing I can say about Reactfast is that I tried them a few years ago, and like most of the blokes they had previously tried in my area, I found them a nightmare. Times change though, and they might be decent to work for now.

JJ 66, contact me through the e-mail in my profile - be glad to help if I can.

 

[Redhotferrari]

Goldspoon, like the post, any chance you can contact me via my email on my profile, would be good to talk to you about your Reactfast experiance.

Look forward to hearing from you.