Plumbing quote gripe, am I in the right?

Joined
4 Jun 2013
Messages
15
Reaction score
0
Location
Kent
Country
United Kingdom
Am I in the right here? Sorry this is a long post.

Over the years have had regular problems with my Heatrae Sadia Megaflo unit dripping through the tundish and out through the overflow and over the years I have had the same heating firm do several jobs to the tank. This has included replacing the pressure relief catridge and valve which have failed twice previously, but they have also replaced the elements and hoovered out the scale at the bottom of the tank. The tank itself seems to be okay.

The firm has just replaced the pressure relief valve for the 3rd time and my gripe relates to their quote. They quoted £120 which I agreed to, £75 labour + £45 part. Half way through the job they said the tank needed to be drained and that would be an extra £55. I said do what needs to be done and I will argue the toss with the boss later as I don't see why the job quote should change half way through the process.

The boss + at least 2 of his employees have done work to the tank & pipework before so know the job well, and on this occasssion although it wasn't the boss who did the work, the boss had been out to see what was needing to be done and the part ordered was down to his diagnosis. The boss was away when one of his employees quoted, but the employee had spoken to him about the job.

I have changed the company and employee names for privacy.

"Hello Ian,

Thank you to your engineer for replacing the pressure relief part.

I have transferred £120 as was quoted to me by Tom but am bemused by the sudden extra £55. This part has previously been replaced 2 times by various members of staff at XYZ Heating, including Tom, so I'm confident everyone concerned knew the work and time involved, and should have quoted accordingly. I understand that Tom spoke to you about the job in the week you were away, so I don't see how there could have been any confusion over job requirements.

I would however completely understand the higher bill if the amount of work involved changed without any possible way of expecting it. As a self employed craftsman who has to stand by their quotes, even when a job takes longer than expected, it seems like XYZ Heating misquoted and rather than taking it on the chin wants me to pay for the error.

I do not like having money gripes and am certainly not trying to wriggle out of paying a bill I know I should be paying (I have had that done to me before and know it's horrible so would never do it to someone else). If you can explain to me why this extra work could not have been foreseen and included in the original quote, I will gladly pay what you feel is owed.

I highly rate XYZ Heating, but cannot afford to foot the bill for someone else's mistake.

Regards"

I expect I'll hear from XYZ Heating on Tuesday after the bank holiday and would appreciate the second opinion of those who know more about plumbing than me. To my mind if you've done the job twice before in one property, you should know what the job entails. Thanks for any advice.
 
Sponsored Links
I spect all the problem was is that the mega flow had lost its air gap , there should be a label on the front or side of the tank that explains how to do this
 
There are instructions, but it wasn't that. Re-establishing the bubble is always the first thing I try when a drip through the tundish starts. It was my girlfriend who was in when the engineer came so I'm hearing this via her, apparantly the engineer said it was a defect in the seating of the valve, so it wasn't seating properly.
 
You may well be in the right, but surely it depends on the reason for needing to drain the cylinder. If there is a reasonable explanation for having to do so on this occasion, but not on previous occasions, then as your letter suggests you will pay up. Its a shame the invoice against which you have paid didn't state the reason for the extra work.

Whatever the outcome, you may find it more difficult to get the firm to work for you in the future, at least on a fixed price basis.
 
Sponsored Links
I think on the previous occassions the tank was drained as part of the process.

All I had was a call from the secretary at the office to say the engineer says the tank has to be drained & that it would cost an extra £55.
 
Are we talking about the viable on the cylinder itself or the safety group in the pipe work feeding the cylinder?

Is this the MK I cylinder? With the Honeywell thermostat cut into the side of the unit?

Perhaps a picture?
 
Are we talking about the viable on the cylinder itself or the safety group in the pipe work feeding the cylinder?

Is this the MK I cylinder? With the Honeywell thermostat cut into the side of the unit?

Perhaps a picture?

It's the 8 bar blue cold water pressure relief valve below the black cartridge. Not the one on the side of the tank.
 
It could be that you are in a hard water area and the lime scale is having an effect on the components.

You mention "over the years". Perhaps you don't realise that cylinders do need regular maintenance.

What was the interval between replacing the T&P valve?

The charging basis seems pretty fair to me.

But they should have been more accurate in their quotes though.

But are they making a free diagnostic visit before quoting? If so that makes them very cheap! Or are you insisting on a free visit to just give a quote? That takes time for the firm!

Tony
 
It could be that you are in a hard water area and the lime scale is having an effect on the components.

You mention "over the years". Perhaps you don't realise that cylinders do need regular maintenance.

What was the interval between replacing the T&P valve?

The charging basis seems pretty fair to me.

But they should have been more accurate in their quotes though.

But are they making a free diagnostic visit before quoting? If so that makes them very cheap! Or are you insisting on a free visit to just give a quote? That takes time for the firm!

Tony

The pressure cartridge & relief valve have been replaced pretty much once a year for the last 3 years.

The boss made a "quote visit" originally where he fitted a pressure meter to establish if the pressure was to blame & to suss out whether the whole tank needed to be replaced. He offered that.

I understand the tanks need maintenance, but each time the tank / pipework has something done to it, it gets all the service work as part of that process. I asked if I should re-establish the air bubble regularly whether there is a drip or not and they said no. Doing the air bubble seemed to be the main component of a £75 service.
 
I have to totally disagree with that.

Allowing the valve to continue to drip creates deposits on the seat and will cause it to need to be replaced.

My advice is to remake the bubble as soon as you see any dripping.

On the face of it they are telling you to do something which will create more work for them.

If it was not for their reasonable charges I would suggest you find another firm.
 
I have to totally disagree with that.

Allowing the valve to continue to drip creates deposits on the seat and will cause it to need to be replaced.

My advice is to remake the bubble as soon as you see any dripping.

On the face of it they are telling you to do something which will create more work for them.

If it was not for their reasonable charges I would suggest you find another firm.

No, I meant when I don't see a drip. I meant as a preventative measure rather than a cure. So you and they aren't in disagreement.

Re-establishing the air bubble has never stopped a drip for me. It has always required a new part to stop the drip.

What I don't understand is how they can discover half way through the job that there is more work in the job than they previously thought when they've done the job twice before? Is there a technical reason for this that I don't understand and they could not predict?
 
You need to regularly check for dripping or put a piece of thin paper across to leave a make.

Only remake the bubble if it is dripping but immediately it does.

I don't know what they are wanting to charge extra for but it is not an unreasonable charge if it is needed.
 
I don't know what they are wanting to charge extra for but it is not an unreasonable charge if it is needed.

To drain the tank.
In the original quote for £120 it can't have included draining the tank because the office rang me half way through the job to say he has to now drain the tank for an extra £55 to bring the job total to £175.
I don't understand how they couldn't have known that would have been required as part of the job.
 
Last edited:
Without getting involved in nitty gritty mud slinging and apportioning blame, may I suggest poster understands the mechanics of system operation.

High pressure water (figurative speech) enters the pressure reducing valve to give working system pressure as indicated on the pressure reducing valve. The cylinder will be subjected to this working pressure when no hot tap is running. ( in fact the cold should also be supplied at this pressure for balanced hot and cold supply at the drawoff)

There is an air bubble that is compressed by the water. Apply heat to the cylinder, pressure rises. You cannot compress water, but the air will take up this increase in water volume.

If the air bubble is depleated like it does after a period of time, cylinder pressure will rise beyond the safety limit imposed on the cylinder at which point the safety valve is jacked up and water discharges

There are two safety valve. One on the outlet of the pressure reducing valve and other on the cylinder. Cylinder mounted valve has a dual function. It is a safety valve as well as a discharge valve that is temperature triggered.

First port of call for repair would be to drain the cylinder and refill. This recreated the air bubble.
Then find our which valve is causing the water discharge. A pressure guage will show system pressure.

Understanding system operation make fault location easier. Not knowing how it functions, leads to needless component replacement.
 
Just put it down to experience,maybe consider an alternative repair company for future repairs.

In your letter did you mention that you would like the company to absorb the extra payment as a gesture of good will as you are a loyal returning customer and you want to retain them for future repairs. This is known as the soft approach,the hard approach is usually dismissed immediately.

Could mention contracts,law,quotes,you not being present,extra work requests etc but not for this small amount not really worth the hassle.

Move on,
 

DIYnot Local

Staff member

If you need to find a tradesperson to get your job done, please try our local search below, or if you are doing it yourself you can find suppliers local to you.

Select the supplier or trade you require, enter your location to begin your search.


Are you a trade or supplier? You can create your listing free at DIYnot Local

 
Sponsored Links
Back
Top