Power line broad band issue , one socket

[Tony13579]

Hi, I have used power line broadband sockets to get broadband in our sprawling bungalow for some years with no problems.

But suddenly it has gone down from 20 meg to 0.1 meg all other sockets tested give 20 meg.

I have turned the power off and tightened the screws. The socket is still providing power. It appears to be on the upstairs ring main switch.

I am a competent person with 15 years phone fault experience.
I have a standard multi meter with tone test.

Is there a good cheep wire tracing tool I buy? Something that would give an increased tone at the fault location? Or do I need to physically trace the wire in our tight loft space?

Thanks Tony

 

[bernardgreen]

Power Line data transmission ( PLDT ) should be avoided as it can have serious implications of interference to other people due to radio frequency radiation from the mains wiring.

http://www.ban-plt.org.uk/emcia.php

http://www.compliance-club.com/default.aspx?id=17

The sudden reduction in data rate could be the result of a neighbour installing PLDT in their house or some wireless equipment you have installed.

Or the PLDT unit has started to fail.

EDIT "cable in loft" have you recent stored or moved a metal item in the loft. PLDT can be affected by a lump of metal close to the cable carrying the data.

 

[Tony13579]

I have recently done insulation work in the loft. We are detached , our house is 2m from next door. Another socket 4m away is temporarily feeding the PC at 5mb with an extension cable as this socket is behind a wardrobe.

I am concerned more that there is an electrical fault that may overheat?. This socket fed the power line unit in and my PC, laser printer, UPS, twin screens, it gets occasional use for soldering iron.

The power line unit is not defective as it does provide 20mb in at least 10 other sockets, just not the only one feeding my Desktop PC.

 

[ericmark]

I would like to see it made illegal to sell items which either break the law when used or are against rules or annoy neighbours be it a security lamp over 150 watt or a CB burner or a Plastic lump you stick in a socket or the PLDT adaptor.

However it seems although other countries for example in Hong Kong to buy radio equipment you needed to show shop either your licence or pass port and with latter sign to say it would be exported with a few exceptions like fire arms in the UK shops can sell illegal items it's called free trade.

So be it a mobile phone hands free device which broadcasts on the car FM radio or a linear amplifier for the CB it can be sold and bought but not used.

There is some debate about if a PLDT is illegal or just antisocial but to me to do anything to encourage there use is wrong.

It would seem EMC is becoming a very real problem with broad band with things like street lights killing broad band even with copper connections. I thought getting fibre optic would cure this but it's still copper into the house.

I would say the cure is to use copper or Wifi even Wifi is having problems with so much using it the airways are swamped. Even central heating is using WiFi now.

I read with interest where shared frequencies are used as secondary users in the UHF range with milliwatt transmitters where the primary user is allow 400W except around Westminster it's just asking for problems.

All it needs if for your neighbour to fit filtered sockets and the interference produced by your PLDT is reduced to a level where it's no longer readable.

 

[Tony13579]

Further thinking, I only tested down stairs sockets. And this one appeared to be fed from the upstairs breaker.

If I broke the ring at the defective socket and tested for continuity round the ring? .

I could also test the upstairs sockets for broadband. If there was a break in the ring there would be a capacitive imbalance. That's murder for phone lines and broadband.

 

[Tony13579]

Power line units are supplied by BT. Are you saying BT provide unlawfull devices?

Do those socket testers you plug in detect a break in the ring main, or do you need to split the ring main to prove a fault?

 

[bernardgreen]

Breakers are a barrier to the radio frequency carrier so having the PLDT link on sockets fed from different rings will be less reliable than if they are in sockets on the same ring.

Power line units are supplied by BT. Are you saying BT provide unlawfull devices?

It is not unlawful to sell them. It is unlawful to use any radio frequency equipment that causes interference to other people.

Do those socket testers you plug in detect a break in the ring main, or do you need to split the ring main to prove a fault?

They do NOT detect broken rings. You will need to split the ring in the correct way and then carry out several measurements to ensure the ring is free of any faults.

 

[JohnW2]

Do those socket testers you plug in detect a break in the ring main,

No. If they are getting approviate voltage on appropriate pins, they are happy and don't know how it's getting to the socket - it could be along just one 'leg' of a broken ring.

or do you need to split the ring main to prove a fault?

One doesn't necessarily have to do that. The integrity of the ring can be ascertained by undertaking continuity tests (on disconnected conductors!) from one end of the ring to the other, at the CU.

Having said that, unless the rogue socket is the very first on the ring (with a break immediately after it), a break in the ring (bad though that is, per se) would not easily explain your experience of just one 'problem socket' out of many.

Kind Regards, John

 

[Tony13579]

Testing from the consumer unit is extremely difficult. Some lovely person placed it at ceiling height, there is a fridge freezer below.

I accept that it's not ideal having a power line unit on different ring mains, however it has been running for 3+ years giving 20mb. I'm not sure when it deteriorated, possibly 2-4 weeks ago. I have mainly noticed because I have some work that requires the twin screens.

I will have to wait till tomorrow to split the ring main and test for continuity.

 

[JohnW2]

Further thinking, I only tested down stairs sockets. And this one appeared to be fed from the upstairs breaker. ... I could also test the upstairs sockets for broadband.

Have you done that yet? It could be that there is a generalised problem with the signal getting to the upstairs sockets circuit, rather than any problem with the wiring of either of the rings (which is probably unlikely).

Kind Regards, John

 

[Tony13579]

I will test the upstairs sockets broadband tomorrow too as the network and power are in full time use most times. ( finding a slot when it's light, no one is recording TV, in the shower, washing , not cooking, not working on the PC. )

 

[JohnW2]

I will test the upstairs sockets broadband tomorrow too as the network and power are in full time use most times. ( finding a slot when it's light, no one is recording TV, in the shower, washing , not cooking, not working on the PC. )

I'm a bit confused. 'Testing the upstairs broadband' surely requires no more than plugging into one of the upstairs sockets, not requiring any switching off of any power? What am I missing?

Kind Regards, John

 

[Tony13579]

Stealing the broadband adaptor that feeds the North of the house and a lap top....

 

[JohnW2]

Stealing the broadband adaptor that feeds the North of the house and a lap top....

Ah

Kind Regards, John

 

[Tony13579]

Well the results are even more mysterious.
Broadband in every upstairs socket is above 5 meg.
Turning the power off, splitting the "ring main" ?
There is no continuity from red to red or black to black.

Restoring power, only one red has 240v.
I was unable to find a spur socket without power but many are inaccessible

My conclusion is that this is a spur socket feeding another spur. I can't understand why it is so capacitvly imbalanced to not support the power line socket. I guess I need a tone and trace set to work out where this cable goes.

It doesn't look like a bodge it and run job, it's all very neat.