Socket outlets for fridge

[maltaron]

I am shortly having a kitchen extension built and recently posted my suggestions, which were approved on this forum.(Part P sparky will do the job and have the final say)
Now for the problem: As the FCU's and sockets for fridges and freezers will not be RCD protected I want to fit non-standard sockets, I rather like the idea of IEC type socket outlets. Does anyone know if these outlets are available on standard plates?

TIA

 

[Chri5]

Silly idea, cutting the plugs off the fridge / freezer invalidates the warranty and when you sell the place non standard sockets will bite you.

Since a new circuit is being installed that circuit must comply with 17th ed, so the use of an RCD (board change likely) or an RCBO (using the existing board if suitable) is a mandatory requirement.

A a Part P scheme registered electrician he must work to the rules and can't sign a 17th ed EIC for the new circuit without the RCD / RCBO.

 

[maltaron]

I note your comments but would add the following: Cutting off the plug on an appliance does not invalidate the warranty-in fact it tells you in the instructions how to change the plug to a different type.

With regard to the other comments I think this shows the problems with different interpretations of regs. As I stated in the post the principle of non RCD sockets for fridges etc has already been approved by sparkies on this site, now you are telling me they are wrong. I will not argue the point and I accept your judgment but as I stated the Sparky who does the job will have final say and my question is "are the IEC sockets available", whether it is legal is another matter.

 

[ericmark]

Some of the 13 different types of IEC types are available with standard socket plates.

The IEC 309 would be only one really suitable and that does not come with standard socket plate. the C13, C14, C15, and C16 plugs and sockets are very common and are used with computers, kettles etc so would not really stop the outlet being used by other people for other items.

The regulations only require a label but the Walsall Gauge plug or BS 546 (15 A/250 V earthed)

could be used but I have issues with separate supplies for fridge/freeze in that if the supply should trip then it may go unnoticed and with the C13, C14, C15, and C16 you are limited to 10A MCB which could trip with inrush and I would use standard 13A socket and I have seen same supply used for intruder alarm supply so if it fails the warning buzzer on intruder alarm at least draws one attention to the failure.

 

[ericmark]

I note your comments but would add the following: Cutting off the plug on an appliance does not invalidate the warranty-in fact it tells you in the instructions how to change the plug to a different type.

With regard to the other comments I think this shows the problems with different interpretations of regs. As I stated in the post the principle of non RCD sockets for fridges etc has already been approved by sparkies on this site, now you are telling me they are wrong. I will not argue the point and I accept your judgment but as I stated the Sparky who does the job will have final say and my question is "are the IEC sockets available", whether it is legal is another matter.

Yes you can have "(b) a specific labelled or otherwise suitably identified socket-outlet provided for connection of a particular item of
equipment." without RCD protection but remember the supply cables will need to comply so likely need wiring in Ali-tube not twin and earth.

 

[Goldberg]

Silly idea, cutting the plugs off the fridge / freezer invalidates the warranty and when you sell the place non standard sockets will bite you.

You're wrong.

Since a new circuit is being installed that circuit must comply with 17th ed, so the use of an RCD (board change likely) or an RCBO (using the existing board if suitable) is a mandatory requirement.

You're wrong.

A a Part P scheme registered electrician he must work to the rules...

Which "rules"?

 

[bernardgreen]

I have issues with separate supplies for fridge/freeze in that if the supply should trip then it may go unnoticed

Invest in an emergency light that automatically comes on when there is a power failure. Run it from the same suppy as the fridge / freezer and it provides light in the power cut and alarm that the fridge / freezer MCB has tripped.

 

[Chri5]

Silly idea, cutting the plugs off the fridge / freezer invalidates the warranty and when you sell the place non standard sockets will bite you.

You're wrong.

Since a new circuit is being installed that circuit must comply with 17th ed, so the use of an RCD (board change likely) or an RCBO (using the existing board if suitable) is a mandatory requirement.

You're wrong.

A a Part P scheme registered electrician he must work to the rules...

Which "rules"?

Look maybe my syntax isn't the same as yours, but at least I can string together more than a few negative comments.

Please, in the sprit of debate / banter attempt to offer less negative responses and more meat on your remarks.

1. Removing moulded plugs from some electrical white goods does invalidate the warranty. Manufactures see the possibility of miswiring LNE and their equipment failing due to such.

2. If the circuit isn't run in 50mm or greater chases, or in earth sheilded cable or containment 17th edition applies- what makes you think it wouldn't ?

3. BS7671 July 2008- Might I suggest you attempt the course

 

[maltaron]

It seems a simple question about availability has stirred up trouble, can I add another possible solution to the original problem. Has anyone seen or used these devices:

http://www.gewiss.com/irj/portal/focusonrestart_IN

and, if so, are they any good.

 

[davelx]

1. Removing moulded plugs from some electrical white goods does invalidate the warranty. Manufactures see the possibility of miswiring LNE and their equipment failing due to such.

Oh FFS! Yes, SOME. But in the vast majority of cases the user instructions clearly instruct you to cut off the plug and fit an appropriate one if the one supplied is not suitable. In those cases it clearly does not invalidate the warranty, or it would say so (and that would be questionable I suspect).

I checked the manuals of all my appliances and every one of them has these instructions.

Why does this come up time and time again? just RTFM.

 

[Steve]

It seems a simple question about availability has stirred up trouble, can I add another possible solution to the original problem. Has anyone seen or used these devices:

http://www.gewiss.com/irj/portal/focusonrestart_IN

and, if so, are they any good.

I take it from your link to a website that shows a brief flicker of an image of an auto-restarting RCD, that this is the item you're referring to.

IIRC, they are about a grand. So, no. They aren't any good.

 

[Goldberg]

Please, in the sprit of debate / banter attempt to offer less negative responses and more meat on your remarks.

I like bacon and beef.

1. Removing moulded plugs from some electrical white goods does invalidate the warranty. Manufactures see the possibility of miswiring LNE and their equipment failing due to such.

Rubbish. Any such ridiculous warranty term would be unreasonable, unfair, and unenforceable. Lamb with mint sauce.

2. If the circuit isn't run in 50mm or greater chases, or in earth sheilded cable or containment 17th edition applies- what makes you think it wouldn't ?

That's not what I said. You said that the 17th Edition, and you named some things in it, is mandatory. It isn't. It's optional. Anyone can choose to follow it or not follow it. Turkey and stuffing.

3. BS7671 July 2008- Might I suggest you attempt the course

Nice bluff.

 

[DCC]

1. Removing moulded plugs from some electrical white goods does invalidate the warranty. Manufactures see the possibility of miswiring LNE and their equipment failing due to such.

Oh FFS! Yes, SOME. But in the vast majority of cases the user instructions clearly instruct you to cut off the plug and fit an appropriate one if the one supplied is not suitable. In those cases it clearly does not invalidate the warranty, or it would say so (and that would be questionable I suspect).

I checked the manuals of all my appliances and every one of them has these instructions.

Why does this come up time and time again? just RTFM.

I strongly doubt any attempt to rule the warranty invalidated soley for changing the plug would stand up in court. Car manaufacturers used to try the same trick "You change something you invalidate the warranty" and it was fairly quickly resolved to only cases where what you did contributed to or caused the problem.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I thought he meant this:

Whatever it is.

Site espresso machine?

A misinterpretation of a spec for a multi-tap transformer?

Actually I suspect it is some kind of site or builders temporary wossname, providing leccy and water....

 

[Steve]

Actually I suspect it is some kind of site or builders temporary wossname, providing leccy and water....[/size][/color]

Yes, so do I