Sorry, probably an obvious question.

[Gary0]

For those not wanting to read all the waffle below, how do you wire a 3 way switch circuit using the new colour scheme ?

-----------------

Done it quite a few times before but want to get the colours right.

Unless I have misunderstood this implies ...

Blue has been replaced by Grey
Yellow has been replaced by Black
Red has been replaced by Brown

But when I looked for confirmation This diagram seems to suggest that ...

Blue has been replaced by Black
Yellow has been replaced by Brown
Red has been replaced by Grey

I don't want to just get it working, any fool can do that. I want to get it such that anyone who comes after me doesn't think, "What on earth did he connect that colour there for".

Could someone set the record straight as to which is correct please ?

Thanks

 

[Lectrician]

There is no rule. They are all lives, and as long as you sleeve them correctly, all is good.

The old colours where used in 2 ways.

Old foke used to put red as common, blue as L1 and yellow as L2

Younger boys put yellow as common, red as L1 and blue as L2

So, transpose the new colours as follows.

RED - BROWN
YELLOW - BLACK
BLUE - GREY

This is the phase sequance, red, yellow, blue or brown, black, grey.



So, I would wire like this, as I am a youngen.

BLACK to common
BROWN to L1
GREY to L2

 

[andy]

as lectrician said, it doesnt matter what colours you use, aslong as there all sleeved with appropriate colours to identify them. altho your not suposed to use black as neutral (not that you have a neutral in the circuit)

 

[Gary0]

I should have guessed. But better safe than sorry.

Thanks both.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Can't get your second link to work, but...

If this cable was for a fan, i.e. L/SL/N, best practice would be to not use black for neutral, in order to disassociate black with neutral, whereas with the old colours people would probably have used blue for neutral.

So on that basis you'd not use black where you would have used blue.

But it's fairly tenuous logic, and I'm not sure how much of a "standard" way there was to wire 3C+E link cables anyway. And as you have no neutrals, it doesn't matter - they all need sleeving in brown, so as long as you don't mix COM/L1/L2 between switches I dont see that it matters which ones you put where....

 

[Gary0]

Cheers also.

Yes noticed the 2nd link wouldn't work - some form of forum censorship has replaced the site name with something about no-ads. I could probably write it in full here, but if the forum owner doesn't like it, maybe I shouldn't. Seems a little over zealous though.

 

[Lectrician]

Can't get your second link to work, but...

If this cable was for a fan, i.e. L/SL/N, best practice would be to not use black for neutral, in order to disassociate black with neutral, whereas with the old colours people would probably have used blue for neutral.

So on that basis you'd not use black where you would have used blue.

But it's fairly tenuous logic, and I'm not sure how much of a "standard" way there was to wire 3C+E link cables anyway. And as you have no neutrals, it doesn't matter - they all need sleeving in brown, so as long as you don't mix COM/L1/L2 between switches I dont see that it matters which ones you put where....

Even with fans, where we used to use RED as live, YELLOW as switched live and BLUE as neutral, the new colours transposed would be BROWN, BLACK, GREY - Grey being L3, and hence Blue. Therefore, it seems logical to me to use the grey as a neutral, and I was doing so long before the NIC and others said not to use the black

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Also, grey is a very neutral sort of colour...

 

[Lectrician]

Give me the good old Red Yellow Blue anyday

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Give me the good old Red Yellow Blue anyday

As long as you can still buy it, I see no reason why you cannot continue to use it when extending old installations for an indefinite period:

1) BS 7671 is not legally mandatory

2) When ostensibly working to BS 7671, departures are allowed for on certificates

3) The Building Regulations require that "Reasonable provision shall be made in the design, installation, inspection and testing of electrical installations in order to protect persons from fire or injury", and it is easily argued that maintaining consistency of colour, particularly with regard to the black/neutral issue, is at least as safe, if not safer, than arbitrarily moving to the new colours.

I don't suppose the cable manufacturers would have liked it, but IMO it would have been far more sensible to have required harmonised colours on new builds and complete rewires, and required the continued use of old colours for changes and extensions to existing installations.

 

[ebee]

Give me the good old Red Yellow Blue anyday

As long as you can still buy it, I see no reason why you cannot continue to use it when extending old installations for an indefinite period:

1) BS 7671 is not legally mandatory

2) When ostensibly working to BS 7671, departures are allowed for on certificates

3) The Building Regulations require that "Reasonable provision shall be made in the design, installation, inspection and testing of electrical installations in order to protect persons from fire or injury", and it is easily argued that maintaining consistency of colour, particularly with regard to the black/neutral issue, is at least as safe, if not safer, than arbitrarily moving to the new colours.

I don't suppose the cable manufacturers would have liked it, but IMO it would have been far more sensible to have required harmonised colours on new builds and complete rewires, and required the continued use of old colours for changes and extensions to existing installations.

Good point.
However I would like to take it further and say "Killer Colours" should never have been brought in. Lets force Europe to adopt good old Red/Yellow/Blue

 

[plugwash]

I don't suppose the cable manufacturers would have liked it, but IMO it would have been far more sensible to have required harmonised colours on new builds and complete rewires, and required the continued use of old colours for changes and extensions to existing installations.

i suspect wholesalers and sparkies would have hated it more than the cable manufacturers.

 

[kai]

Don't you think it's rather daft to try to disconnect Black and Neutral on the new colours? (Black and Neutral seem to be naturally linked).

 

[Adam_151]

Don't you think it's rather daft to try to disconnect Black and Neutral on the new colours? (Black and Neutral seem to be naturally linked).

As Blue has been replaced by Grey, it makes more sense to me to now use Grey for neutrals where you would have used blue before, rather than try and work to an old association between black and neutral which doesn't exist in any colour scheme in use anymore (ok i'fe fastforwarded a few months, easier to phrase, lol)

 

[plugwash]

the main counter-argument is that diyers familiar with the old system will assume the black is neutral and then guess the grey is the extra wire.

whichever one you do make sure you mark appropriately.