System advice

[vulcancontinental]

Hi all

Hope everyone is well!

I need some help as getting conflicting advice from some heating engineers I’ve had around to quote.

I currently have a gravity fed system which when we moved in a couple of years ago was on a W plan, which I immediately had changed to a S+ plan. Current boiler is a Valiant ecotec plus 438, set at part load as it cycles a lot. Not not if boiler is 100% right. We are planning renovations for next year and want to move the boiler as well as upgrade to an unvented cylinder (new water mains needed as well). The house has 3 floors and will end up with 21-23 radiators in total, some large ones but also some smaller ones. Currently pipework comes off valves at 22mm and then predominantly 15mm runs everywhere.

Now I’ve had a few heating guys over and I’ve been told my current boiler size is fine @ 38kw but also some state an 18kw one would suffice as well. They all said to put new runs of 22mm in and drop down to 15mm for each radiator.

Can anyone help with advice/suggestions. I’m a bit stuck as to what is correct, changing the boiler isn’t an issue if it needs it.

Thanks in advance

Draw it out with all the rad sizes, take pics of the outside of the house, tell me how much loft insulation you have and whether there's cavity fill and how you think the pipe are sized are run and for a bit of fun I'll do the lot. It will not be done this week probably but I'd be surprised if it doesn't surprise you.

 

[b21playa]

Draw it out with all the rad sizes, take pics of the outside of the house, tell me how much loft insulation you have and whether there's cavity fill and how you think the pipe are sized are run and for a bit of fun I'll do the lot. It will not be done this week probably but I'd be surprised if it doesn't surprise you.

Thank you, much appreciated

I’ll get some pictures, drawings and measurements together. The news are not in place yet, but will put the proposed sizes in as I’m slowly going to go through and change them as we refurbish

 

[b21playa]

Draw it out with all the rad sizes, take pics of the outside of the house, tell me how much loft insulation you have and whether there's cavity fill and how you think the pipe are sized are run and for a bit of fun I'll do the lot. It will not be done this week probably but I'd be surprised if it doesn't surprise you.

Hi Vulcan

Thanks for taking this on for a bit of fun, it's much appreciated. I've added pictures of front + rear and floor plans of proposed radiator locations, rough new pipe locations and sizes. Currently 22mm comes off zone valve and I'm 99% confident changes to 15mm / 1/2" pipework under the floor. My plan is to run 22mm throughout and reduce to 15mm just before each radiator. It's a S plan+ with zone valve for HW, Heating D/s and heating for 1st & 2nd floor

Its a solid brick house with no cavity and approx 50mm loft insulation (hard to tell as don't have access to loft space). Please excuse the crude drawing, I'm no artist

If you need anything else, please let me know

 

[bernardgreen]

How will you get access to the dining room ?. I cannot see a door or a window in the plan,

 

[vulcancontinental]

Hi Vulcan

Thanks for taking this on for a bit of fun, it's much appreciated. I've added pictures of front + rear and floor plans of proposed radiator locations, rough new pipe locations and sizes. Currently 22mm comes off zone valve and I'm 99% confident changes to 15mm / 1/2" pipework under the floor. My plan is to run 22mm throughout and reduce to 15mm just before each radiator. It's a S plan+ with zone valve for HW, Heating D/s and heating for 1st & 2nd floor

Its a solid brick house with no cavity and approx 50mm loft insulation (hard to tell as don't have access to loft space). Please excuse the crude drawing, I'm no artist

If you need anything else, please let me know


View attachment 258708 View attachment 258709 View attachment 258707 View attachment 258706 View attachment 258710

Just looking at it now I'd say as a 5 minute guess, forgetting your written radiator sizes but going on heat loss of 19.5kW and if 22mm and 15mm pipework probably 857l/hr@ΔT 20°C 2m index circuit. Priority domestic hot water.

All a guess as I say, I'll assume more and try to calculate this weekend.

I'm interested to see how close I'll be.

 

[b21playa]

How will you get access to the dining room ?. I cannot see a door or a window in the plan,

Sorry the dining room is currently a garage and part of the plans to convert into a dining room with the door off the hallway.......well spotted

 

[b21playa]

Just looking at it now I'd say as a 5 minute guess, forgetting your written radiator sizes but going on heat loss of 19.5kW and if 22mm and 15mm pipework probably 857l/hr@ΔT 20°C 2m index circuit. Priority domestic hot water.

All a guess as I say, I'll assume more and try to calculate this weekend.

I'm interested to see how close I'll be.

Thank you....I'm seriously intrigued to see this. I know most engineers (not slating them) just look at the house and quote the biggest 'standard' boiler. We have a 38kw Vaillant 438 at the moment which I 've turned down to about 20kw as it cycles too much. Setting it too low means the house doesn't warm up flow temp is 55 even though set at 75

 

[vulcancontinental]

Probably too short notice and no we don't put them on youtube , sorry.

This afternoon’s Vokera by Riello webinar at 4pm, 25th January 2022 is Heating Optimisation and Efficiency.

It covers

Heat loss: guessing and calculated (join in our poll with your estimate).

Range rating the heating output.

Boiler modulation.

Heat gains with the Royle Family.

Over pumping flow rate and head loss estimates (another poll)

Pump modulation options

Priority domestic hot water.


This course is not restricted to Gas Safe Engineers only.


Use the link below to register.


https://carrier.zoom.us/webinar/register/2215979244261/WN_BTvpOcI8SLK6sZASlbuqsw

 

[CBW]

Probably too short notice and no we don't put them on youtube , sorry.

This afternoon’s Vokera by Riello webinar at 4pm, 25th January 2022 is Heating Optimisation and Efficiency.

It covers

Heat loss: guessing and calculated (join in our poll with your estimate).

Range rating the heating output.

Boiler modulation.

Heat gains with the Royle Family.

Over pumping flow rate and head loss estimates (another poll)

Pump modulation options

Priority domestic hot water.


This course is not restricted to Gas Safe Engineers only.


Use the link below to register.


https://carrier.zoom.us/webinar/register/2215979244261/WN_BTvpOcI8SLK6sZASlbuqsw

Are you doing another one? The link is asking for gas safe details, with an asterisk denoting mandatory.

 

[b21playa]

Are you doing another one? The link is asking for gas safe details.

I got the same

 

[b21playa]

The other issue I have is old radiators with old valves which are stuck open so can not balance radiators as a temp measure. All the rads need changing anyway apart from the 2 I’ve already changed

 

[vulcancontinental]

Shame you missed it. That shouldn't have been on there, it's not mandatory. The guy that does it is relatively new and running the whole show for the first time.

They're usually run every two months.

 

[CBW]

They're usually run every two months.

Great, I’ll keep ‘em peeled for future ones, wouldn’t mind bulking up my knowledge, it’s a tad rusty.

 

[vulcancontinental]

The next Heating Optimization and Efficiency webinar is 7pm 22nd February.

https://carrier.zoom.us/webinar/register/2215979244261/WN_MvmjBYumR9eZlwYEkcujEw

Let me know if they still want GS registration please.

 

[CBW]

Let me know if they still want GS registration please.

Yes, it’s asking for it, not a problem for me, as I could give mine