Top flat, all power gone
- Thread starter ChrisR
- Start date
I haven't read any legislation that requires that.ChrisR said:
The Wiring Regs document is the de-facto standard for safe installations, so religious adherence to it is a way of demonstrating safeness, but not the only way.
Yes, I'm with you on that, and I'm not encouraging you to do anything you believe is risky or that you're uncomfortable with. I'm just observing that you're competent, and that you know how to replace like with like, and you can arrange for testing, of whatever is necessary, to be carried out when the professionals get back from the beach on Tuesday.
Softus said:
It's quite strange really as the regs are non-statutory, but if you read inside they say that all electrical installations (apart from specialist installations, off-shore, mines etc) must comply with them.
It's just entrenched arrogance.ricicle said:
Back in 1986 I visited the IEE office, in Stevenage, to purchase a copy of the current regs (at the time, the 15th Edition).
They wouldn't sell me a copy because I wasn't a qualified electrician.
As an act of work it will fall into the scope of the Electricity at Work Regs.
Unlike most Statutory Instruments, if you are charged with violating an absolute regulation the onus is put on the accused to prove they have complied. This is the where working to a recognised set of regulations is definately a good idea!!
Unlike most Statutory Instruments, if you are charged with violating an absolute regulation the onus is put on the accused to prove they have complied. This is the where working to a recognised set of regulations is definately a good idea!!
As far as I can gather it applies to the self employed, part 3 here: http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si1989/Uksi_19890635_en_2.htm#mdiv3
The defence regulation is the one I was thinking of here: http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si1989/Uksi_19890635_en_5.htm#mdiv29
The defence regulation is the one I was thinking of here: http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si1989/Uksi_19890635_en_5.htm#mdiv29
I know all that, but you've missed the point of this Act, which is to uphold the safety of people who are at work.
See http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si1989/Uksi_19890635_en_8.htm#exnote for more information.
So, in the context of this topic, Chris has a statutory duty to safeguard himself, and anyone he employs, but SI 1989:0635 is nothing to do with safeguarding innocent bystanders who are not working with/for him, and who shouldn't be there.
In case you're about to point out that Chris is obliged to prevent bystanders (and/or tenants) being exposed to danger, then of course he is, but my point is that SI 1989:0635 is irrelevant here, because each of us has a general duty of care, all of the time, to act responsibly, and prudently, and in such a way as to minimise the risk of injury to ourselves and to others.
See http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si1989/Uksi_19890635_en_8.htm#exnote for more information.
So, in the context of this topic, Chris has a statutory duty to safeguard himself, and anyone he employs, but SI 1989:0635 is nothing to do with safeguarding innocent bystanders who are not working with/for him, and who shouldn't be there.
In case you're about to point out that Chris is obliged to prevent bystanders (and/or tenants) being exposed to danger, then of course he is, but my point is that SI 1989:0635 is irrelevant here, because each of us has a general duty of care, all of the time, to act responsibly, and prudently, and in such a way as to minimise the risk of injury to ourselves and to others.
No. The fact that the person is an employee, or a self-employed person, is irrelevant.Spark123 said:
Leaving behind a hazard would be, if the result of simple human error, a tort of negligence, or, if incompetence, then, in some circumstances, an act of criminal negligence. Without going into huge detail, criminal negligence generally places a higher burden of proof upon a prosecuting party, whereas civil negligence is assumed unless the accused party can show that they took reasonable steps to prevent foreseeable harm to person or property.
Almost certainly a breach of the Health & Safety at Work Act 1974 if they are working (duty to the public as well as employees/workmates etc).
Duty of care in the eyes of the law.
Well if I'm not sure what I'm doing I'd be in breach of the Management of Safety at Work Act, no doubt, by putting myself at risk .
Anyway, it has come out that the cable at ground level is some sort of nasty old rubbery stuff, but pvc where it appears atop the 2nd floor. SO there's a join - somewhere in the wall. Maybe could find it by thermal imaging after it's been sparking fora while...
The route for a replacement would seem to be up the outside wall, some 10 - 12m height.
Am I right in guessing that that would
1) be something like 16mm² SWA?
2) need scaffolding to be fixed - or would a ladder be reasonable.?
Total length would be around 20-25m.
Still looking for an electrician. Thought I'd found one until I asked about his qualifications, then his English got a bit poor and it was going to be difficult...
The landlord wants it right, asap, at whatever it costs. That's why I work for him.
Anyway, it has come out that the cable at ground level is some sort of nasty old rubbery stuff, but pvc where it appears atop the 2nd floor. SO there's a join - somewhere in the wall. Maybe could find it by thermal imaging after it's been sparking fora while...
The route for a replacement would seem to be up the outside wall, some 10 - 12m height.
Am I right in guessing that that would
1) be something like 16mm² SWA?
2) need scaffolding to be fixed - or would a ladder be reasonable.?
Total length would be around 20-25m.
Still looking for an electrician. Thought I'd found one until I asked about his qualifications, then his English got a bit poor and it was going to be difficult...
The landlord wants it right, asap, at whatever it costs. That's why I work for him.
ChrisR said:
Picture??.......................
Don't you have a sparky who helps you out of tight spots with some of your heating problems.....................................
What size is the fuse supplying this cable.This might give a clue to its's size (but then again maybe not)
It sounds like an interesting one.If you were nearer I wouldn't mind looking at this one (and I'm not even a contractor)
Ladders should really only be used for light work at height (no pun)
A reasonable size armoured would tend to pull you over making it hazardous.I'd go for scaffold if t'were me
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