Twin brown brown and earth

[JohnW2]

Always used twin brown. (Well actually twin red before it.) They're all phase conductors so should not be further identified.

"should not" is surely not appropriate? I agree that, in many cases one 'need not' further identify them, but the suggestion that there is something 'wrong' with adding (any sort of) 'further identification' is just ridiculous.

Kind Regards, John

 

[Risteard]

"should not" is surely not appropriate? I agree that, in many cases one 'need not' further identify them, but the suggestion that there is something 'wrong' with adding (any sort of) 'further identification' is just ridiculous.

Kind Regards, John

All it would do is make it less clear that it's a phase conductor. I believe "should not" is fair.

 

[bernardgreen]

It can help to know which Brown is permanent Live and which is Switched Live when it is more than a single ON-OFF switch.

 

[ajohn]

"should not" is surely not appropriate? I agree that, in many cases one 'need not' further identify them, but the suggestion that there is something 'wrong' with adding (any sort of) 'further identification' is just ridiculous.

Kind Regards, John

It would need yet another cable for things like hall landings lights.

Personally if I go near the mains I always have a neon test screwdriver around. 2 reason. Some one may have switched L & N and wiring as most of it can't be seen may be different to what is expected. Use of these cables on ordinary switches is another reason. As always it's tested to be functional any time it's used. That's often easy and should be done what ever is being used.

Some don't like them but I always think "well they contain 2 extremely reliable parts", a resistor and a neon so the main thing is a well made one.

 

[bernardgreen]

well they contain 2 extremely reliable parts", a resistor and a neon

and they totally rely on the person holding it to be at or very close to Ground potential

 

[ajohn]

and they totally rely on the person holding it to be at or very close to Ground potential

Not exactly. They rely on a person having some maximum resistance to ground. The neon gets dimmer and dimmer as that goes up. Helped in my view by making sure they give a decent light at the voltage they should be used at with some resistance to ground. Perhaps their biggest drawback is certain limitations. Neon striking voltage for instance but can meet VDE specs and the resistor in them is a rather high value eg

https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/mains-test-screwdrivers/0828022/

I prefer the longer ones though.

 

[DetlefSchmitz]

I think your description demonstrates why people shouldn't be relying on these. And the vendor you quote also does not seem to understand physics:

"Wera single-pole voltage tester is a simple device that checks for electrical current passing through a circuit. It is helpful when doing any kind of DIY electrical work." (sic)

 

[ajohn]

LOL It does as part of the circuit is the user. Perhaps they should make that clearer but there is no circuit until a finger touches one of the contacts. Better add the one on the screwdriver.

 

[JohnW2]

All it would do is make it less clear that it's a phase conductor. I believe "should not" is fair.

I still think it's pretty ridiculous to suggest that adding additional information to indicate the precise function of a conductor can ever be 'wrong' or result in a reduction in clarity.

 

[ajohn]

I still think it's pretty ridiculous to suggest that adding additional information to indicate the precise function of a conductor can ever be 'wrong' or result in a reduction in clarity.

The cable is there as it's seen to be better than what was used. I've not had much interest in cable colours and regs but with the dual independent light switch circuit it is a visual improvement as either may be live but if anyone wanted to know which one they would have to test it.

One single simple switches the earlier way where neutral returned live it was very obvious which one was live. The other end of the circuit was also obvious if it could be seen. Use 2 browns and they need testing at the switch to find out which is live.

So for simple switching another style of cable is needed. That brings up what colours to use and degrees of colour blindness and the need to make it.

But to cap it all IET diagrams show standard cable being used for simple switches. Very clear visually at both ends. At one end it will ( or should be ) the only place an L to N connection will be seen.

 

[EFLImpudence]

the earlier way where neutral returned live it was very obvious which one was live.

Was it?

You are writing nonsense. Please stop.

 

[bernardgreen]

the only place an L to N connection will be seen

in a bright flash until the circuit protection operates.

If you meant ""the only place a Brown to Blue connection will be seen "" then you appear to have fallen into the common trap of thinking "Blue means this wire is Neutral"

 

[ajohn]

No I meant L to N as earlier colour codings are still about in very large numbers and 2 standards might be used in the circuit.

 

[DetlefSchmitz]

-sigh-

 

[ajohn]

Was it?

You are writing nonsense. Please stop.

Go argue with the IET. Why do you think they still show standard wire being used for a light switch and not twin brown?

The problem really is that electricians are trained. Once only in factories etc that employed them slowly but surely all need to be.