Vaillant EcoMax Pro 28E main heat exchanger damaged

[DrTosh]

The PCB on our 3 year old boiler failed last week. The Vaillant engineer has visited and diagnosed this fault but noticed a bolt missing from the heat exchanger. He also noticed the seal was changed at the last service a few months ago to a graphite seal. No-one has touched the boiler since this last service.

The vaillant engineer has advised that the engineer who did the service must have damaged the heat exchanger as these bolts do not snap off themselves. Naturally the engineer who did the service is denying responsibility (& blaming the Vaillant engineer for doing this damage), probably because a new heat exchanger will cost over £300.

My question, to anyone who might know something about these boilers, is whether they would agree with the Vaillant engineer that this damage could only have been caused by the engineer who did the service, and whether the Vaillant engineer might have done this damage when investigating why our boiler had lost all electrical power.

I have been issued with a warning notice that my boiler is dangerous and should never have been left in this condition.

Many thanks for any comments about this.

 

[Boilerman2]

It's going to be impossible to prove now that two engineers have touched the boiler, but my feeling is that the weight of guilt must lie with the guy that did the service, but you will be very lucky if you can prove it!

 

[Beerlover]

Unfortunately the studs on the main heat exchanger will shear if overtightened and are not replaceable by themselves. Who put the new seal in? The finger would point at him.

The loss of electrical power was probably,( I wasn't there) caused by condensation in the cabinet because of the now faulty seal.

I speak with bitter experience it has happened to me. Went for routine service, left the customer with no boiler for two days while part was ordered.

 

[DrTosh]

Thanks - that's very interesting. One final question...

The Vaillant engineer was in our house for no more than 15-20 minutes before explaining what he found to me. I wonder if it is possible to diagnose an electrical fault with the PCB and do this damage to the heat exchanger (presumably by undoing the bolts, investigating whatever he might have had to investigate, and then doing them up again - overtightening one in the process).

I am guessing that there would be no reason to look at the heat exchanger/graphite seals when diagnosing this electrical fault? I am also guessing that these bolts don't simply corrode with time and fall off.

 

[Beerlover]

The loss of electrical power was probably,( I wasn't there) caused by condensation in the cabinet because of the now faulty seal.

He would not have disturbed the boiler seal as it would require a new one to be fitted. There is nothing electrical inside there.

 

[gas4you]

I wouldn't rush to blame the first engineer. The group service engineers that are sent are often not much cop usually and will look for any excuse to blame someone else these days.

Many have their heads up their own ar*es and can TALK a good job

I have refused to fit Vaillant for a long time now due to the poor standard of their direct employed engineers.

It wouldn't surprise me to find that it was just a faulty/weak stud dating back to manufacture. But then Vaillant are often economical with the truth about their faults.

 

[Beerlover]

I wouldn't rush to blame the first engineer. The group service engineers that are sent are often not much cop usually and will look for any excuse to blame someone else these days.

Many have their heads up their own ar*es and can TALK a good job

I have refused to fit Vaillant for a long time now due to the poor standard of their direct employed engineers.

Please explain to me why he would have touched the case seal for an electrical fault. Neither of us were there and all I can comment on is probable cause without predjudice or prejudgement. Please tell me you're not up for jury service soon.

BTW why would you need to call a Vaillant engineer - can you only TALK a boiler repair?

 

[mickyg]

The group service engineers that are sent are often not much cop usually and will look for any excuse to blame someone else these days.

maybe thats just your experience. You've been slagging them off for years and they all know who you are , so one can speculate

 

[gas4you]

I don't call on group service engineers, for ANY reason with Vaillants.

I do tell customers to call them if they have a Glow Worm, as I won't work on these usually, apart from a basic service.

AFAIK there are only 2 proper vaillant engineers left in the country.

One of them is an agent working my patch and the other IIRC is either Northampton or Nottingham

What my agent doesn't know about Vaillants isn't worth knowing, but he won't touch Glow Worm etc.

But then each to his own

 

[mickyg]

so how did you come to your previous conclusion then? hearsay?

 

[gas4you]

I'm a bit lost now. Which previous conclusion?

The reasons I don't fit vaillant anymore because of the treatment customers have had by warranty engineers are fact, not hearsay.

Ok, I may be generalising by labelling the whole country based on the ones on my patch, but then if that is what group service take on, why should it be different in other parts of the country.

I know of one who seems to spend more time worrying about whether the property next door to the one he is visiting doesn't conform to current regs, that I wonder whether he actually gets any proper work done!

Perhaps you are a good example of one who is good at his job and has left them.

Anyway, I'm not going to get into a group service quality argument. They are just not worth it. Customers can judge them on their own merit.

Oh to bring back the good old days of Vaillant before they bought out Glow Worm

 

[mickyg]

I appreciate where your coming from Dave with your experiences. Obviously you know me and DM both used to work for Group Service. Additionally I still know alot of guys who still work there who I genuinely believe are good engineers. I appreciate they have some bad ones, but I don't think its any worse than any other company out there. So its no surprise I take great exception to your comments. This is not personal

 

[DP]

It might have been a good idea to look at the snapped bolt where it sheared. Was the shear bright (as if very recent) or tarnished as in sheared a while ago.

Went to a 831 last week where the CH control was no longer attached to the shaft that turns the pot on the PCB. The customer was not aware of this. Showed him the control and the discolouration where the shaft and control had sheared. Else would have been lumbered with the damage.

 

[harold5]

theres no reason for the group service guy to lie to you. if he had snapped it off(it does happen but i seriously dought he did because there was no reason to take the heat engine out) then he would have ordered a new one and fitted it .its just another job to him.

 

[DrTosh]

Thanks for all the advice. Does anyone know how long it might take an engineer to actually replace a primary heat exchanger on this boiler.