Neighbour proposing to site boiler flue within my boundary
- Thread starter KTL
- Start date
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You could put a notice on the wall pointing out that no consent has been given for anything to be mounted and anyone doing so will be subject to legal action.
Most installers are unconcerned but a notice might make them pause if they can read English. Not all can!
Most installers are unconcerned but a notice might make them pause if they can read English. Not all can!
The wall visible in the pics is not a party wall.
The wall in the house (not visible in the pics) between the two windows which separates the two apartments is a party wall.
The wall in the house (not visible in the pics) between the two windows which separates the two apartments is a party wall.
My neighbour reallly isn't getting it! She emailed to Prop Management below..... following her decline to attend a mediation meeting.. The point is even if I never ever get planning permission approved, the flue is still not going to spout out its noxious fumes and plumes into my patio area, on my land!
"without prejudice
Dear .....the reality is, because of the layout of my kitchen there is only one place that is suitable for fitting the boiler. The boiler will be fitted in my kitchen, within my property. It is therefore completely unreasonable to be expected to reconfigure my kitchen (at who's cost???) for some proposed plans that may not be approved.
rgds ,,,,, "
I just love the 'without prejudice' bit, since if ever there were prejudice against my proposed planning permission (which I don't even intend to build, just use it to help sell my property, though I don't see why I should tell her this!)
"without prejudice
Dear .....the reality is, because of the layout of my kitchen there is only one place that is suitable for fitting the boiler. The boiler will be fitted in my kitchen, within my property. It is therefore completely unreasonable to be expected to reconfigure my kitchen (at who's cost???) for some proposed plans that may not be approved.
rgds ,,,,, "
I just love the 'without prejudice' bit, since if ever there were prejudice against my proposed planning permission (which I don't even intend to build, just use it to help sell my property, though I don't see why I should tell her this!)
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The outside wall of the house does not separate your property from hers. So it is not a "party wall" as defined by the Party Wall Act 1996.
See Party Wall Act explanatory booklet para 3, page 6.
The fact that you may or may not be building an extension is not really relevant. If the patio is your property, she is not allowed to discharge the products of combustion directly over your property. The flue has to be a minimum of 300mm from your boundary, i.e to the right of your patio fence. But she is then caught by the rules about distances from openings (300mm) and drainpipes (150mm).
There is nothing to stop her drilling a hole through the wall. The obvious solution is to use a plume management kit to raise the discharge point. Provided, of course, that the terminal does not infringe the regulations regarding distance from the windows upstairs!
See Approved Document J Pages 49 and 50.
Yes I agree doc J is the strongest ruling against her actions, I was merely pointing out earlier that this is not the only consideration, since there is also the trespass issue and also possibly contravening lease clause re my quiet enjoyment of my property, over and above concerning H&S issues.
I now have a dilemma since I can either let her act and be damned, after which I call in Building Control/Gas Safe to condemn the flue, or still my more preferred route to have some form of mediation where other options can be considered.
I did ask her about whether her contractor had mentioned a flume management kit but at that point she told me she didn't have to discuss it with me, the reason I asked was because I would have suggested that this may be a way around her perecption that there is no where else she can put the boiler in her kitchen, since I understand it can vertically elevate the flue outlet and so maybe can be sited at the end of the house away from my patio.
However, with the current proposed site for the flue, even if plume were pointed up higher and pointed away from my flat I am still not sure it would resolve the fact that its still within my boundary and without my consent.
I now have a dilemma since I can either let her act and be damned, after which I call in Building Control/Gas Safe to condemn the flue, or still my more preferred route to have some form of mediation where other options can be considered.
I did ask her about whether her contractor had mentioned a flume management kit but at that point she told me she didn't have to discuss it with me, the reason I asked was because I would have suggested that this may be a way around her perecption that there is no where else she can put the boiler in her kitchen, since I understand it can vertically elevate the flue outlet and so maybe can be sited at the end of the house away from my patio.
However, with the current proposed site for the flue, even if plume were pointed up higher and pointed away from my flat I am still not sure it would resolve the fact that its still within my boundary and without my consent.
I wouldn't go down the plumb management kit, it is still in you space and can still drip acid as well as the wind blowing the plumb down.
Only consideration would be a flue up the wall and discharged above the gutter.
Sorry I would make her move the kitchen being as she is unreasonable.
Only consideration would be a flue up the wall and discharged above the gutter.
Sorry I would make her move the kitchen being as she is unreasonable.
P
Phill Peck
Write her a letter saying that she or her installer has no right to your property and that you suggest she finds an alternative solution should she choose to go ahead with the work then you will take the necisarry steps with gas safe and HSE to have the situation rectified which could result in her gas supply being disconnected.
The fact that the window to the left doesn't open is not relevant it is still an opening in the fabric of the building and therefor a potential opening which would make the installation "Not To Current Standards" which you cannot have on new installations
I recently dealt with a similar situation invoking a job detractor fan terminating onto my parents property at their new house the neighbour originally said it was there now and they would just have to live with it j looked up a few regs and wrote a letter to him explaining that he was not allowed to pollute our air he got legal advice and 2 weeks later we received a letter from his solicitor asking for permission to enter their property to brick up the outlet after it had been re routed to an acceptable position.
This was just for an extractor fan I'm pretty sure you will be able to legally force them to move it so it would be stupid of them to do it
The fact that the window to the left doesn't open is not relevant it is still an opening in the fabric of the building and therefor a potential opening which would make the installation "Not To Current Standards" which you cannot have on new installations
I recently dealt with a similar situation invoking a job detractor fan terminating onto my parents property at their new house the neighbour originally said it was there now and they would just have to live with it j looked up a few regs and wrote a letter to him explaining that he was not allowed to pollute our air he got legal advice and 2 weeks later we received a letter from his solicitor asking for permission to enter their property to brick up the outlet after it had been re routed to an acceptable position.
This was just for an extractor fan I'm pretty sure you will be able to legally force them to move it so it would be stupid of them to do it
The words "without prejudice" is a legal term usually used in disputes
Its purpose is to make the letter private correspondence and inadmisable in legal procedings. But its use is over used and there are rules to its use
I'm not an expert in law but I would say that the letter above is an "open letter" and not a "without prejudice" letter as she makes no offer to resolve the dispute, she just makes a statement. I could be wrong though
Matt
lol yes I am aware of the use and terminology of 'without prejudice' I was just musing on the irony of the term, given the content of her email clearly showing very much prejudicial reasons why she wants to site flue where she's trying to ie. she thinks this will add grist to her argument to scupper my planning permission approval....
My reasoning re putting in ffor PP was to hopefully increase interest in my flat from a wider range of potential buyers (it is a small flat) giving scope to the right buyer to expand it if they so wish. It is a punt really, only cost £1k to put it in, and won't necessarily get this sum back but may give added factor to a sale. If I don't get PP hey I lose £1k I'd maybe spend on a holiday, but its not to me the end of the world and not relevant to this issue, since its still a patio for my sole use and right to enjoy, without plumes from her boiler.
My reasoning re putting in ffor PP was to hopefully increase interest in my flat from a wider range of potential buyers (it is a small flat) giving scope to the right buyer to expand it if they so wish. It is a punt really, only cost £1k to put it in, and won't necessarily get this sum back but may give added factor to a sale. If I don't get PP hey I lose £1k I'd maybe spend on a holiday, but its not to me the end of the world and not relevant to this issue, since its still a patio for my sole use and right to enjoy, without plumes from her boiler.
KTL you are in the right, you dont need any justification. what your neighbour wants is simply unreasonable and against the rules.
had a classic example the other day. my customer and I want to great effort and expense to route the flue through the roof as to not go in to next doors garden...
along comes kitchen "designer" and "designs" the kitchen with the extractor fan going in to next doors garden... I point out the mistake and get "Oh, I am sure the neighbours dont mind"
some real planks in this world
had a classic example the other day. my customer and I want to great effort and expense to route the flue through the roof as to not go in to next doors garden...
along comes kitchen "designer" and "designs" the kitchen with the extractor fan going in to next doors garden... I point out the mistake and get "Oh, I am sure the neighbours dont mind"
some real planks in this world
Its the blatant riding roughshod over my rights/property that really riles me, absolutely no respect at all.
Ironically, her property is the only one in the complex where planning permission was sought for the construction of a rather large conservatory (& agreed to by all us sucker neighbours) yet now she is being completely unreasonable about *heaven forbid* any one else seeking it... Rich ain't it!
I know for a fact she has a perfectly good spare bedroom around the other side of the conservatory within which a boiler could be placed - the flue could easily be sited on that external wall away from other windows, and anyone else's property, but that'd mean a taste of humble pie, which she clearly hates the taste of ...
Ironically, her property is the only one in the complex where planning permission was sought for the construction of a rather large conservatory (& agreed to by all us sucker neighbours) yet now she is being completely unreasonable about *heaven forbid* any one else seeking it... Rich ain't it!
I know for a fact she has a perfectly good spare bedroom around the other side of the conservatory within which a boiler could be placed - the flue could easily be sited on that external wall away from other windows, and anyone else's property, but that'd mean a taste of humble pie, which she clearly hates the taste of ...
D
Deleted member 63160
Theres a site with a forum called "garden law". Lots of advice.
I'd be worried about letting it go ahead, with the thought of making her life difficult afterwards. Once it's there who knows what will happen?
Are the Police going to pursue it as an act of criminal damage? Maybe.
Are Gas Safe or the HSE going to take retrospective action; indeed can Gas Safe do anything if he Installer isn't registered.
I'd see a civil case for trespass as being most positive action, but whilst you might receive damages I don't know if the Court has the power to order the removal of the flue.
I would write to her ASAP pointing out all of the ways in which she will be breaking the law, explicitly refusing permission to enter your garden, and possibly pointing out the alternatives (terminating through the roof?) in the hope that she'll see sense.
And if I had the chance I'd fit a tall spikey gate to stop anyone getting in!
Are the Police going to pursue it as an act of criminal damage? Maybe.
Are Gas Safe or the HSE going to take retrospective action; indeed can Gas Safe do anything if he Installer isn't registered.
I'd see a civil case for trespass as being most positive action, but whilst you might receive damages I don't know if the Court has the power to order the removal of the flue.
I would write to her ASAP pointing out all of the ways in which she will be breaking the law, explicitly refusing permission to enter your garden, and possibly pointing out the alternatives (terminating through the roof?) in the hope that she'll see sense.
And if I had the chance I'd fit a tall spikey gate to stop anyone getting in!
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