Government wants to increase dodgy counterfit tobacco sales

[Ricardus]

We did win two World Wars on a "cuppa splosh" and a "Woodbine Cigarette".

Didn't realise the opposition were tee-total non-smokers

Hitler condemned smoking " It was decadent" also the drinking of Alcohol

The tobacco bit is true. I never thought I'd actually have something positive to say about the Nazi party.
//www.diynot.com/wiki/http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-tobacco-movement-in-Nazi-Germany

 

[AronSearle]

does that mean that all brands will look the same so cheaper brands could be sold as expensive brands?

Yup, it will make it easier for cheap knockoffs made in china or russia, containing much more dangerous chemicals, to be sold as the real thing, after all, how can you tell them apart with plain packets?

Good point. Why haven't the government thought of that?

They have, but will likely ignore the issue, as australia did.

And if you disagree, well, that just means you have been paid off by big tobacco and want children to smoke.

Why do you want children to smoke JBR?

(that's how the debate will be framed)

 

[JBR]

And if you disagree, well, that just means you have been paid off by big tobacco and want children to smoke.

Why do you want children to smoke JBR?

(that's how the debate will be framed)

Where did I say that I want children to smoke?

 

[AronSearle]

And if you disagree, well, that just means you have been paid off by big tobacco and want children to smoke.

Why do you want children to smoke JBR?

(that's how the debate will be framed)

Where did I say that I want children to smoke?

No silly, I'm saying htat's how the debate will be framed, those who oppose it will be accused of not caring about children / being in the pocket of big tobacco.

 

[EddieM]

Smoking and drinking (alcohol) cost more than the revenue received from the sales of such......... Who would agree with me that that statement is utter BS. Sales of alcohol and tabacco aren't banned for a couple of simple reasons, there is not point trying to ban alcohol as its easy to make your own and both bring in huge revenues.

Similar debate re drugs, I don't understand why drugs aren't decriminalised and synthesied in labs and administered in a controlled fashion. Ok I, like most people don't like the idea of folk being addicts etc, but think of all the benefits. Drug cartels wrecked, smugglers rendered irrelevant, drug associated crime removed ..... And the addicts themselves getting a known quality correct dosage, plus necessary support to get clean.

Add into that dramtically reduced police / border control intervention, why is it not a no brainer.

 

[JBR]

Smoking and drinking (alcohol) cost more than the revenue received from the sales of such......... Who would agree with me that that statement is utter BS. Sales of alcohol and tabacco aren't banned for a couple of simple reasons, there is not point trying to ban alcohol as its easy to make your own and both bring in huge revenues.

Similar debate re drugs, I don't understand why drugs aren't decriminalised and synthesied in labs and administered in a controlled fashion. Ok I, like most people don't like the idea of folk being addicts etc, but think of all the benefits. Drug cartels wrecked, smugglers rendered irrelevant, drug associated crime removed ..... And the addicts themselves getting a known quality correct dosage, plus necessary support to get clean.

Add into that dramtically reduced police / border control intervention, why is it not a no brainer.

Two very good points. I, too, have heard that taxes on alcohol and tobacco more than pay for the trouble they cause to the NHS and the police. And you are quite right; when we worked in Saudi Arabia, where alcohol is illegal of course, we and almost all ex-pats made our own alcohol. I have to admit that our wine was ever so slightly crap, but that is irrelevant.

I also agree about drugs, although we'd have to be very careful not to encourage even more drug use.

 

[EddieM]

Smoking and drinking (alcohol) cost more than the revenue received from the sales of such......... Who would agree with me that that statement is utter BS. Sales of alcohol and tabacco aren't banned for a couple of simple reasons, there is not point trying to ban alcohol as its easy to make your own and both bring in huge revenues.

Similar debate re drugs, I don't understand why drugs aren't decriminalised and synthesied in labs and administered in a controlled fashion. Ok I, like most people don't like the idea of folk being addicts etc, but think of all the benefits. Drug cartels wrecked, smugglers rendered irrelevant, drug associated crime removed ..... And the addicts themselves getting a known quality correct dosage, plus necessary support to get clean.

Add into that dramtically reduced police / border control intervention, why is it not a no brainer.

Two very good points. I, too, have heard that taxes on alcohol and tobacco more than pay for the trouble they cause to the NHS and the police. And you are quite right; when we worked in Saudi Arabia, where alcohol is illegal of course, we and almost all ex-pats made our own alcohol. I have to admit that our wine was ever so slightly crap, but that is irrelevant.

I also agree about drugs, although we'd have to be very careful not to encourage even more drug use.

I agree entirely, the draconian criminalisation of drug abuse has utterly failed to stop an increase in drug use, I do not wish to see anyone hooked on the stuff, however people who have fallen prey should at least be able to get clean safe and known doeses of their habit, whilst being weaned off it. Drugs are classless one of my best mates is a habitual user.. He is also a multi millionaire (through his own endevours)

 

[JBR]

I'm not sure which way things would go if drugs were legalised.

Yes, the best outcome would be the removal of drug dealers whose raison d'etre lies in making lots of money out of encouraging the weak-willed to become addicted to drugs. That would be a good thing, of course.

What I'm not convinced about, though, is that if drugs were as freely available as tobacco and alcohol are at present, would that in itself encourage the same weak-willed to experiment. If that resulted in an increase in drug use, it would be almost as bad although, of course, drug barons would not be getting rich at drug users' expense. I suppose the government would reap the benefits in additional taxation!

I'd like to think that, if drugs became legal, there could be some way of discouraging their use. Unfortunately, I can't think what that might be.

 

[AronSearle]

I'm not sure which way things would go if drugs were legalised.

Amsterdam has legal weed = low use, lowest drug related deaths.

Portugal decriminlised drugs = use fell.

 

[JBR]

I'm not sure which way things would go if drugs were legalised.

Amsterdam has legal weed = low use, lowest drug related deaths.

Portugal decriminlised drugs = use fell.

Marijuana is not really much of a problem. I'm talking about harder drugs. Legalising heroin or LSD and the like might possibly have an adverse effect for the reasons I gave. I repeat, I'm not sure what safeguards should be put in place to prevent this.

 

[EddieM]

I'm not sure which way things would go if drugs were legalised.

Yes, the best outcome would be the removal of drug dealers whose raison d'etre lies in making lots of money out of encouraging the weak-willed to become addicted to drugs. That would be a good thing, of course.

What I'm not convinced about, though, is that if drugs were as freely available as tobacco and alcohol are at present, would that in itself encourage the same weak-willed to experiment. If that resulted in an increase in drug use, it would be almost as bad although, of course, drug barons would not be getting rich at drug users' expense. I suppose the government would reap the benefits in additional taxation!

So its just the weak willed who dabble with drugs...... hmmm.... i dont think thays right in any way shape or form.





I'd like to think that, if drugs became legal, there could be some way of discouraging their use. Unfortunately, I can't think what that might be.

I dont think it is entirely fair to call addicts weak willed, after all if you are a heroin addict it would be very foolhardy to just stop, it could easily kill you, hence methadone. Like all right minded people I dont want to see anyone addicted to substances but the present system of criminalisation demonstrably doesnt work.