Front of House Lights Setup

[PASUK]

Hello

I am planning on fitting four outdoor lights to the front of my property and ideally I would like them to auto switch-on when it gets dark until about 11pm, then to all switch on if motion is detected.

I am guessing I need to buy four standard lights, a standalone photocell, a standalone PIR sensor and some sort of timer switch.
??

Any advice if this is correct, and how something like this gets wired up?

Thanks

 

[EFLImpudence]

Yes, that sounds correct.

You will need to wire Neutral and CPC(earth) to all items.
Supply >> Switch/FCU >> timer >> PIR >> Photocell >> lights 1,2,3,4.

The line(live)

.................................>> timer >> Photocell >>
Supply >> Switch/FCU........................................lights 1,2,3,4 AND
.................................>>>>>> PIR >>>>>>>>

Depending on location and routes you will likely need three core+E from timer to photocell - with the PIR by-passing the timer and photocell.

 

[flameport]

I am planning on fitting four outdoor lights to the front of my property

Hopefully that means 4 wall lanterns or similar with 6W LEDs in them.

Not a set of four 500W halogen beam efforts to illuminate half the street and all of the neighbours bedrooms.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Don't buy any controls/sensors which don't need a neutral.

 

[Lectrician]

A time clock with volt free contacts preferred, as it can be placed AFTER the photocell. Most photocells cycle on for a period when power is first applied.

 

[Spark123]

Budget depending, I have installed sangamo solar clocks before. They switch on at dusk and can either be set to switch off at dawn or at a set time between 8pm and 1am GMT. If you want to go this route you need to make sure you get the right one for your latitude.
Buckinghamshire will put you in Zone 2 (zone 2 – 52ºN: Q550-13, Q550.13.12, 0550130012) hence one like this will do:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sangamo-Q...e-Switch-D9-/171941914154?hash=item280889662a
I can't see a problem with bridging the contacts with a PIR.

 

[JohnW2]

A time clock with volt free contacts preferred, as it can be placed AFTER the photocell. Most photocells cycle on for a period when power is first applied.

Agreed, but most 'consumer' time switched don't have 'volt-free' contacts (I suppose for fairly obvious reasons). However, if one uses the layout EFLI suggested, the initial 'on-cycle' of the photocell is not likely to be a problem, since it is supplied by a PIR - which, itself, probably will be configured to not work during daylight.

In my case, to achieve the same functionality as the OP wants, I have timeswitch (NOT volt-free) -> photocell -> (multiple) PIRs -> lights. That means that the lights come on for 30 seconds mid-afternoon (when the time switch switches on, and powers up the photocell, hence PIRs), but that's the only (trivial) downside.

Kind Regards, John

 

[EFLImpudence]

Budget depending, I have installed sangamo solar clocks before. They switch on at dusk and can either be set to switch off at dawn or at a set time between 8pm and 1am GMT. If you want to go this route you need to make sure you get the right one for your latitude.

That seems an odd way to do it.

Why don't they just have a clock for switching off and use a photocell for on?

 

[Spark123]

They are good where it isn't practical to have a photocell, for light reasons or it is just too awkward to get one in place. It also saves on wiring and you don't need to have a lovely looking photocell in plain view.

 

[JohnW2]

They are good where it isn't practical to have a photocell, for light reasons or it is just too awkward to get one in place. It also saves on wiring and you don't need to have a lovely looking photocell in plain view.

That's all true. On the other side of the coin, they assume that dusk and dawn will occur 'when they should' for the time of year (and latitude) - i.e. they don't know about varying weather conditions in the way that a photocell does.

Kind Regards, John

 

[Lectrician]

A time clock with volt free contacts preferred, as it can be placed AFTER the photocell. Most photocells cycle on for a period when power is first applied.

Agreed, but most 'consumer' time switched don't have 'volt-free' contacts (I suppose for fairly obvious reasons). However, if one uses the layout EFLI suggested, the initial 'on-cycle' of the photocell is not likely to be a problem, since it is supplied by a PIR - which, itself, probably will be configured to not work during daylight.

In my case, to achieve the same functionality as the OP wants, I have timeswitch (NOT volt-free) -> photocell -> (multiple) PIRs -> lights. That means that the lights come on for 30 seconds mid-afternoon (when the time switch switches on, and powers up the photocell, hence PIRs), but that's the only (trivial) downside.

Kind Regards, John

I would have the PIR bypass the time control and photocell completely.
Grasslin immersion timers have volt free contacts with the link removed, as do many others. Bog standard DIY type. If you look, you will find.#
Trivial but IMO not professional. There us little excuse to not get a volt free type, and let the photocell stay powered (how it is intended).
The time clock should be set with a view of OFF period, not on. You should be setting the times you want it OFF.

 

[EFLImpudence]

and let the photocell stay powered (how it is intended).

I'm struggling to see what difference that would make.
Surely, they are permanently powered only because they do not have an integral timer.

The time clock should be set with a view of OFF period, not on. You should be setting the times you want it OFF.

They all do that.

 

[Lectrician]

and let the photocell stay powered (how it is intended).

I'm struggling to see what difference that would make.
Surely, they are permanently powered only because they do not have an integral timer.

The time clock should be set with a view of OFF period, not on. You should be setting the times you want it OFF.

They all do that.

Yes all timeclocks do, but it doesn't mean people set them that way. People seem obsessed with "on" periods.

Having a photocell turn the lights on for a setup period every day is daft, pointless and non-professional. It's so easy to do it correctly, why have lights coming on every day "mid afternoon" when you don't have to? Bodgy bodgy bodgy.

 

[EFLImpudence]

I have just realised that you are talking about John's situation and not the OP's.


Do photocells have a set-up period?

I know PIRS do.

 

[Lectrician]

Yes, most do. Some 30 seconds or so, some longer.

It can be a good thing to check lights are working, power cycling key switch, switch or mcb, but a timer should always be after the photocell IMO.