LED Strip Lights - wiring to lighting circuit - Update

[SwitchTheElectricsOff]

Morning all!

The thread has been locked, so can't give an update, I've received the LED strip pack and taken a photo of the power supply, it's one of these brick devices that you connect a laptop-style plug to

View media item 101651

 

[ericmark]

In general lighting and heating can be split into two groups, required for living, and decoration and ambience. There are strict rules for required for living, the amount of lumen per watt for lights, and energy rating for heating, this is why we no longer have tungsten lamps or open hearth fires, as main lighting or heating, however we can still use log burners and silly lights for decoration and ambience.



The main point is any light or fire which is for decoration and ambience needs to be installed in such a way its use is optional, so fire is not required to be lit for central heating to work, and standard lights can be used without having to switch on lights for decoration.



So two switches on the wall one for standard lights and one for decoration is OK, single switch working both, not, unless there is something like a pull cord to switch off the decoration.



Today we should expect all new lights to give 50 lumen per watt, or more, old lights OK it is not retrospective, but new lights should be better than 50 lumen per watt.


However as yet there is no law to say all that, it is just common sense, so if you want to fit 13A sockets to lighting circuits or fit lights at 25 lumen per watt you still can, and that is the way it should be.



What you do want however with decoration is if an error is made or something fails it should only take out the decorative lamps not the main lights. As to if a 1A fuse will rupture before a 6A MCB not sure, but if fitted then you have watched your back, i.e. if the power supply fails short circuit and the fuse does not rupture and after being plunged into darkness the occupant is injured, you can stand up with hand on bible and say you took all reasonable care.

 

[flameport]

it's one of these brick devices that you connect a laptop-style plug to

In that case all the options are available - put a plug with 3A fuse on the end of the power lead, or wire it to a 3A FCU, or wire it directly to a 6A lighting circuit.
Isolation is achieved by removing the plug from the power supply.

 

[SwitchTheElectricsOff]

Thankyou for that, I didn't know any of that - it helps me to work out what to do in the other rooms when asked, in terms of use as 'optional' can this be way of a remote control?

In general lighting and heating can be split into two groups, required for living, and decoration and ambience. There are strict rules for required for living, the amount of lumen per watt for lights, and energy rating for heating, this is why we no longer have tungsten lamps or open hearth fires, as main lighting or heating, however we can still use log burners and silly lights for decoration and ambience.



The main point is any light or fire which is for decoration and ambience needs to be installed in such a way its use is optional, so fire is not required to be lit for central heating to work, and standard lights can be used without having to switch on lights for decoration.



So two switches on the wall one for standard lights and one for decoration is OK, single switch working both, not, unless there is something like a pull cord to switch off the decoration.



Today we should expect all new lights to give 50 lumen per watt, or more, old lights OK it is not retrospective, but new lights should be better than 50 lumen per watt.


However as yet there is no law to say all that, it is just common sense, so if you want to fit 13A sockets to lighting circuits or fit lights at 25 lumen per watt you still can, and that is the way it should be.



What you do want however with decoration is if an error is made or something fails it should only take out the decorative lamps not the main lights. As to if a 1A fuse will rupture before a 6A MCB not sure, but if fitted then you have watched your back, i.e. if the power supply fails short circuit and the fuse does not rupture and after being plunged into darkness the occupant is injured, you can stand up with hand on bible and say you took all reasonable care.

 

[SwitchTheElectricsOff]

Thankyou for the help!

Please excuse my complete ignorance, normal power maintenance low level I can deal with (extensions, doubling up etc), this is a new area for me

The 3A fuse sounds a bit iffy, so literally put a 'normal' type socket on the lighting circuit in the loft and put a 3A fuse in the power lead and just plug in?

The 3A FCU, so something like this (https://www.electrical2go.co.uk/mode-3a-fused-connection-unit.html) connected to the lighting circuit and the normal power cord connected to that (with a 3A fuse)?

In terms of wiring directly, is that strip the cord of the black AC/DC adaptor into the circuit, or the white remote control box?

Or.... is there a similar product that I can wire directly in to the circuit? I'm not too sure what I should search on to look at a solution

In that case all the options are available - put a plug with 3A fuse on the end of the power lead, or wire it to a 3A FCU, or wire it directly to a 6A lighting circuit.
Isolation is achieved by removing the plug from the power supply.

 

[JohnW2]

The 3A fuse sounds a bit iffy, so literally put a 'normal' type socket on the lighting circuit in the loft and put a 3A fuse in the power lead and just plug in?

What sounds iffy? Yes, you could do as you describe - and incore anyone who says that you can't/shouldn't connect a 'normal' 13A socket to a lighting circuit. However, it's sensible to label the socket to indicate that it is on a lighting circuit, and therefore not suitable for large loads like vacuum cleaners (which could trip the lighting circuit's breaker)

The 3A FCU, so something like this (https://www.electrical2go.co.uk/mode-3a-fused-connection-unit.html) connected to the lighting circuit and the normal power cord connected to that (with a 3A fuse)?

As flameport said, if you wired it to a 6A lighting circuit, you would not actually need that additional 3A fuse. However, having said that, a 3A switched FCU might nevertheless be a simple way of having a means of isolating the power supply - you could just use a switch, but an FCU may well be cheaper"!

Kind Regards, John

 

[SwitchTheElectricsOff]

Thanks for that John!

For me, wiring up a socket in the loft for a light is just something I wouldn't have thought of, or expected! If I used a plug socket, would I even need to isolate when I could unplug the kit? (apologies for the simplicity, it's the only way I can understand), would an FCU with the additional power socket be too much of a complication, but more of a belt and braces approach (which I'm happy to do)?

For the alternative approach I don't understand how I would wire the kit directly to the lighting circuit, what wire cord on this kit would I cut to connect it? Would I cut the thinner output black wire from the AC/DC adaptor and use that as the connection? Or cut the plug off and use that side? (although I am starting to prefer the socket idea)

What sounds iffy? Yes, you could do as you describe - and incore anyone who says that you can't/shouldn't connect a 'normal' 13A socket to a lighting circuit. However, it's sensible to label the socket to indicate that it is on a lighting circuit, and therefore not suitable for large loads like vacuum cleaners (which could trip the lighting circuit's breaker)
As flameport said, if you wired it to a 6A lighting circuit, you would not actually need that additional 3A fuse. However, having said that, a 3A switched FCU might nevertheless be a simple way of having a means of isolating the power supply - you could just use a switch, but an FCU may well be cheaper"!

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

Thanks for that John! For me, wiring up a socket in the loft for a light is just something I wouldn't have thought of, or expected! If I used a plug socket, would I even need to isolate when I could unplug the kit?

No - unplugging is the ultimate in isolation.

... would an FCU with the additional power socket be too much of a complication, but more of a belt and braces approach (which I'm happy to do)?

It's either/or - either a socket (and a plug) or direct-wired into an FCU(or switch).

For the alternative approach I don't understand how I would wire the kit directly to the lighting circuit, what wire cord on this kit would I cut to connect it? Would I cut the thinner output black wire from the AC/DC adaptor and use that as the connection? Or cut the plug off and use that side? (although I am starting to prefer the socket idea)

The latter - cut the 'mains plug' off it and then connect that cut-off cable to the FCU/switch. However, as you say, the socket approach is probably fractionally simpler - but, as I warned, at least one person here will probably moan about that approach, and I would suggest that you should ignore him!

Kind Regards, John

 

[SwitchTheElectricsOff]

Thanks John, I've actually learn't a lot from you, thankyou for your clear explanations and your patience

I'm going to do the FCU approach, as then I can mount that safely on the joist eaves and label it up

I'll send she who must be obeyed out to the builder suppliers to get a decent FCU, and get it done, hopefully it should look fantastic with the drop down ceiling island thing she wants

No - unplugging is the ultimate in isolation.
It's either/or - either a socket (and a plug) or direct-wired into an FCU(or switch).
The latter - cut the 'mains plug' off it and then connect that cut-off cable to the FCU/switch. However, as you say, the socket approach is probably fractionally simpler - but, as I warned, at least one person here will probably moan about that approach, and I would suggest that you should ignore him!

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

I'll send she who must be obeyed out to the builder suppliers to get a decent FCU, and get it done, hopefully it should look fantastic with the drop down ceiling island thing she wants

Make sure that she gets a switched FCU (they come with and without switches) and, unless you've already got one, you'll need to get a 3A fuse (the FCU will very probably come with a 13A one in it).

Kind Regards, John

 

[SwitchTheElectricsOff]

Checked, and stipulated a switched one! Also told her to get a pack of fuses as we need some anyway

That's the only thing I'd trust her with, the last time I asked her to fully switch off the consumer unit whilst I changed a double plug, well, let's just say after that shocking incident I check everything myself now

Make sure that she gets a switched FCU (they come with and without switches) and, unless you've already got one, you'll need to get a 3A fuse (the FCU will very probably come with a 13A one in it).

Kind Regards, John

 

[winston1]

You seem to be getting some poor advice here.

Fused connection units are not used or required on lighting circuits which are adequately protected by a 6amp MCB. A 3amp cartridge fuse has no discrimination against a 6amp MCB anyway.
Wiring a 13amp socket to a lighting circuit is very bad practice and should be avoided. Strangely it is allowed but surely some day it will be banned.

Just wire it onto a junction box or existing ceiling rose as you would any other light.

Why has John got this obsession with an isolation switch in the loft? No other lights have such isolation. As Flameport says the best isolation is obtained by removing the connector from the power supply.

 

[JohnW2]

Predictable, if nothing else.

I personally would not use an FCU. I would probably, despite your views, use a 13A socket (or a switch). Even if that current power supply has a mains lead which can be unplugged from the PSU, subsequent ones may not, although I agree that (as flameport said) direct wiring into the lighting circuit would be acceptable for anyone who did not feel the need for a means of 'isolation'.

It's all a matter of personal choice. I would personally prefer not to have to do without the entire lighting circuit if the PSU developed a fault which required isolation somewhere. For that reason, I tend to have a DP switch on the branch of a lighting circuit supplying each group of, rooms (or, in some cases, just one room).

Kind Regards, John

 

[winston1]

But every light, including LED strips, has isolation all be it single pole by the wall switch. A PSU fault would not require you doing without the lighting any more than the fault in a pendant.

 

[JohnW2]

A PSU fault would not require you doing without the lighting any more than the fault in a pendant.

It woudn't - but which is far more common - a fault in a PSU or a 'fault' in a pendant?

Maybe it's just me, but I don't really like the concept of any electronic device being hard-wired directly into a final circuit (of any sort), particularly if the device does not have a switch on the input.

Kind Regards, John