can you use 3 phase SWA cable for 230vAC single phase?

[Risteard]

Do you understand that you can't just claim my country and hoist the Butcher's Apron? It's not the National Flag and never shall be.

Can we please have all traces of this abomination removed:

View attachment 375081

No part of Derry lies within the Republic of Ireland, it is entirely part of the sovereign territory of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

This is the flag for the nation where Derry is:

View attachment 375082

Do you understand

 

[Risteard]

How many people have been jailed in Ireland for doing their own electrical work?

Several.

 

[morqthana]

Do you understand that you can't just claim my country and hoist the Butcher's Apron? It's not the National Flag and never shall be.

Sorry - but you are the one making claims on another country. I am not claiming anybody elses.

Derry IS, it really, REALLY IS part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

I do not appreciate people planting flags of a foreign country in it and claiming that it is now part of that country. That's the sort of thing people like Putin do. Is he someone you like to emulate?

 

[morqthana]

Several.

Can't find a record of a single one on the CRU site.

What's your basis for "several"?

 

[JohnW2]

Can't find a record of a single one on the CRU site. What's your basis for "several"?

Seeing this exchange made me wonder whether, even in the UK, it might be theoretically possible (even if it has never happened) to be imprisoned for contravention of any of the Building Regs.

However, when I looked, the Building Regs refers to the "Penalties" section (Section 35) of the Building Act 1984, and that only talks about levels of fines, with no mention of imprisonment.

That obviously means nothing in terms of some other country's laws, but is, I think, a fairly interesting observation!¬

 

[morqthana]

Building Act 1984 S.35

(1)A person who contravenes a provision of building regulations, or a requirement imposed by virtue of any such provision, commits an offence.

(2)Building regulations may provide that subsection (1) does not apply in relation to a prescribed provision of the regulations.

(3)Building regulations may provide that, in relation to a prescribed provision of the regulations, it is a defence for a person charged with an offence under this section to prove such matters relating to the contravention as may be prescribed.

(4)A person guilty of an offence under this section is liable—

(a)on summary conviction, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding the maximum summary term for either-way offences or a fine (or both);

(b)on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years or a fine (or both);

 

[Risteard]

Seeing this exchange made me wonder whether, even in the UK, it might be theoretically possible (even if it has never happened) to be imprisoned for contravention of any of the Building Regs.

However, when I looked, the Building Regs refers to the "Penalties" section (Section 35) of the Building Act 1984, and that only talks about levels of fines, with no mention of imprisonment.

That obviously means nothing in terms of some other country's laws, but is, I think, a fairly interesting observation!¬

From safeelectric.ie:

• Except for certain Minor Electrical Works* it is a criminal offence for a non-registered Contractor to carry out electrical work in a domestic premises. The penalties for non-compliance set out in the Energy (Miscellaneous Provisions) 2006 Act (the 2006 Act) include a fine of up to €50,000 and/or imprisonment for up to 3 years.

 

[morqthana]

... in the UK, ...

From safeelectric.ie:

 

[Risteard]

Obviously in relation to the information which brought up the issue about the "UK" you doofus. And to show that it is not a like situation in terms of penalties and enforcement.

 

[morqthana]

Obviously in relation to the information which brought up the issue about the "UK" you doofus. And to show that it is not a like situation in terms of penalties and enforcement.

Thank you for your civility.

JohnW2, having seen the exchange about the situation in the RoI wondered what the situation was in the UK.

And you thought that quoting the rules for the RoI would be an appropriate response. OK.

Any joy on explaining why you said that "several" people have been imprisoned in Ireland for doing their own electrical work?

 

[JohnW2]

Building Act 1984 S.35
(1)A person who contravenes a provision of building regulations, or a requirement imposed by virtue of any such provision, commits an offence.
(2)Building regulations may provide that subsection (1) does not apply in relation to a prescribed provision of the regulations.
(3)Building regulations may provide that, in relation to a prescribed provision of the regulations, it is a defence for a person charged with an offence under this section to prove such matters relating to the contravention as may be prescribed.
(4)A person guilty of an offence under this section is liable—
(a)on summary conviction, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding the maximum summary term for either-way offences or a fine (or both);
(b)on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years or a fine (or both);

Thanks. This is interesting. Having looked again, that is indeed what Section 35 of the up-to-date version of the Building Act 1984 (including all subsequent amendments) says - and, as you obviously intend to illustrate, it does include a provision for imprisonment.

I didn't notice at the time (apologies!) but what I had looked at was the original version of the Act, in which Section 35 merely says (only) ...

This is the original version (as it was originally enacted).

35Penalty for contravening building regulations​

If a person contravenes any provision contained in building regulations, other than a provision designated in the regulations as one to which this section does not apply, he is liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding level 5 on the standard scale and to a further fine not exceeding £50 for each day on which the default continues after he is convicted.

... hence my p[revious comment.

 

[ebee]

Well it always amazes me and always has done.
Rather than examine what is actually said, what is actually written or what is actually done or not done as being correct or being incorrect it seems to me that some are saying because I have been doing this as a practising/qualified electrician or farmer or doctor or florist or boat builder or politician or butcher or baker or candlestick maker then this or that must be what is written!

It must mean that the likes of Donald J Trump must know better than those who are not as old as he is.

Reminds me of a woman, many years ago, who informed me that because she had worked in a mill for a long time that she knew what the law said whereby I had I who had never worked in a mill knew nothing about the law!
A bit like someone who has been doing a job for many years assuming superiority over those who have only been doing it a short whilke because they are "Senior" to you!
Well yes they are senior to you in age, yes they may have more experience than you but they are not senior in the hierarchy of the company, thety are on the same paygrade and have no extra authority than you or me.
Like me or you they could be right or wrong - that is purely dependant upon whether they actually are right or wrong and nothing to do with whether they were DIYers or Electricians or anything else.

Reminds me of when we were kids and a rival gang used to want to have a fight with us to decide which of our gangs was "best at cricket". result - the other gang was always best at cricket because they were better fighters than us.

What is written in the regs is what is written in the regs, what is best practice is what is best practice, what we should not do is what we should not do. None of it is dependant on who said it or who did not say it.

I do know a bloke who can spout reg after reg after reg, mostly word perfect too, but then he occasionally makes "regs" etc of hearsay or determinations made by other in his or allied organisations (NICEIC example) , whilst over 90% of what he says is correct and word perfect then some of the remaining 10% starts to make you wonder what planet he is on

Perhaps I am a simple soul!

 

[Risteard]

Thank you for your civility.

JohnW2, having seen the exchange about the situation in the RoI wondered what the situation was in the UK.

And you thought that quoting the rules for the RoI would be an appropriate response. OK.

Any joy on explaining why you said that "several" people have been imprisoned in Ireland for doing their own electrical work?

I have in the past. So perhaps you should read back through old posts and not waste my time.

 

[JohnW2]

I have in the past. So perhaps you should read back through old posts and not waste my time.

That could be a very tedious exercise for us. If, as you have implied, you are aware of evidence that people have been imprisoned in ROI for contravening these regulations, it would be helpful/thoughtful of you to point us towards that evidence, hence saving us a lot of time.

Most/all questions posed in forums such as this could be answered by doing enough searching/reading, but it's much easier/quicker if someone already knows the answer and can provide it instantly 'from their head'.

 

[morqthana]

That could be a very tedious exercise for us. If, as you have implied, you are aware of evidence that people have been imprisoned in ROI for contravening these regulations, it would be helpful/thoughtful of you to point us towards that evidence, hence saving us a lot of time.

Most/all questions posed in forums such as this could be answered by doing enough searching/reading, but it's much easier/quicker if someone already knows the answer and can provide it instantly 'from their head'.

Well – it turned out, because of the lack of any such posts, to be quite a short job – basically about as long as it took to make and drink a mug of tea.

I searched the entire site for posts by Risteard with various search terms. The ‘table’ below shows, for each term, the number of posts found which contained details of someone being imprisoned in Ireland for doing their own electrical work.

Imprisoned	0​
Prison	0​
Jail	0​
Jailed	0​
Gaol	0​
Gaoled	0​

So it would seem that this claim:

Any joy on explaining why you said that "several" people have been imprisoned in Ireland for doing their own electrical work?

I have in the past.

Is just as untrue as this one:

How many people have been jailed in Ireland for doing their own electrical work?

Several.

In summary, all the available evidence here, and on the Internet, shows the following:

Nobody has ever been imprisoned in Ireland for doing their own electrical work
Risteard falsely claims that they have been
Risteard falsely claims to have provided proof that they have been

Given the extent of his false statements, I would struggle to agree with the suggestion that Risteard is not fully aware that they are false when he makes them.