new combi boiler install: not happy

[easyflow]

Thats one of the worst carcus jobs iv seen, was the fitter ****ed.

 

[WDIK]

The installer is required to leave the Installation Instructions and Benchmark logbook with the customer not take it away as I assume you meant by "but kept the paperwork"

reg 29

 

[Agile]

Thats pretty good compared with many I see in London!!!

Its not all green around the joints is it!

And it has the blanking plugs where the power flusher was fitted!

About the worst I have seen had ALL the five connections to the boiler in 9 mm bore flexible ( tap ) connectors !!!

Tony

 

[gowgowuk]

Really rough workmanship, but the worrying part is the gas feed. It's connected to (original?) 15mm pipe. This is wrong unless the gas meter is really close. The other possible problem is the condensate pipe. it looks horizontal in the picture, but it should fall about 2.5degrees. Check the installation manual.

HI,

I've been told that gas pressure has been tested and opening the floor was not needed (but originally was quoted for the job so there was a possibility). Condensing pipe slope is ok I think.

Thanks

Philippe

 

[gowgowuk]

I would call them back the quality of workmanship is terrible, I think the bypass is to close to the boiler, most bypass valves are fitted a minimum of one meter away plus a gate valve is not the correct thing to use as a bypass. The condensate does not look correct and the gas pipe also looks wrong, you are ment to upgrade the system with trv's and a roomstat too, let me guess was it done in one day?

They are coming back on Monday and I'm preparing my case! It was done in 2 days. I have TRVs and roomstat

Thansk for the comments

 

[gowgowuk]

I am pretty sure that WB INSIST on at least 22mm minimum gas pipe to their boilers so that 15mm is going to blow any warrantee out of the window.

as has been said that is the shonckiest bit of work I have seen in a while and I hate having a go at another mans work but jaysus thats ruff

Actually, ALL the installers I asked for a quote (including the most recommended one) said that it's not necessary if the gas pressure is tested and is ok. The 15mm probably run only for a few meters: there a 22mm pipe coming out of the gas meter which probably goes down to 15mm under the floor just in front of the boiler...

Thanks

 

[gowgowuk]

If it's not an optical illusion and the gas pipe does connect to that 15mm pipe then it is just plain wrong.. the pressure drop between the meter and the boiler has got to be more than 1 Mb.. I suspect that is why the price was substantially lower than the other quote. I hate pulling up floors to renew the gas supply but it has got to be done..

Having said that far too many customers think that I am trying to rob them when I say about the new gas supply...

Hi,

As I said above, it was a possibility that they would need to open the floor but they found it was not necessary as the gas pressure was tested (all the other installers I ask said the same thing). The pipe from the gas meter is 22mm and prob. just a few meter of 15mm before joining the boiler.

Thanks

 

[gowgowuk]

The installer is required to leave the Installation Instructions and Benchmark logbook with the customer not take it away as I assume you meant by "but kept the paperwork"

Actually, another one had more recommendations, but was substantially more expensive

Why does that not surprise me - you pays your money & takes your choice.

I know what you are saying, but at some point you have to make a choice/balance between recommendations and price asked. Or do you systematically go for the highest quote? All of the 3 installers I asked for a quote had some sort of recommendations, and short of knocking on people's door to take picture of their installation, it's quite difficult to judge. If I hadn't had this bypass valve problem, I would not have posted this picture here and would not have realized how shoddy the work was (not being a plumber), and therefore I would probably have recommended these people as well. That just show how flimsy the recommendations could be...
Philippe

 

[Agile]

The pipework really is not that bad!

People on this site love to be critical of all other people's work!

I would say that its about the average of what I see in London!

The only thing which is not right is the gate valve used as a bypass. It should have been a proper auto bypass valve but they cost about £20. Thats one of the results of not having a better installer or a fully itemised quotation.

As for the 15 mm gas supply. That is bound to be giving more than the 1 mB pressure drop allowed in the British Standard.

Some others hate me for saying this but you can call CORGI and ask them to measure the pressure loss and if they agree the loss is too great then they will serve a defects notice on the installer and require him to upgrade it at no further cost. CORGI visit free!

They used to require the drop to be no less than 1 mB but some inspectors are now accepting a mimimum of 18 mB at the boiler inlet if thats the minimum specified by the manufacturer.

I dont think yours will test as adequate if you have any 15 mm on the gas supply.

Tony

 

[gowgowuk]

The pipework really is not that bad!

People on this site love to be critical of all other people's work!

I would say that its about the average of what I see in London!

The only thing which is not right is the gate valve used as a bypass. It should have been a proper auto bypass valve but they cost about £20. Thats one of the results of not having a better installer or a fully itemised quotation.

Thanks, I fell slightly better... When they are coming back on Monday, I may point out that it looks a bit shabby but I am not going to insist on that. After all, as long as it's working and safe. But I will definitely question the bypass. The Worcester Bosch documentation says clearly that for this model bypass is not required, but even if it is, I think it should be automatic.

As for the 15 mm gas supply. That is bound to be giving more than the 1 mB pressure drop allowed in the British Standard.

Some others hate me for saying this but you can call CORGI and ask them to measure the pressure loss and if they agree the loss is too great then they will serve a defects notice on the installer and require him to upgrade it at no further cost. CORGI visit free!

They used to require the drop to be no less than 1 mB but some inspectors are now accepting a mimimum of 18 mB at the boiler inlet if thats the minimum specified by the manufacturer.

I dont think yours will test as adequate if you have any 15 mm on the gas supply.

Tony

About that, I think it was properly tested but I will insist also when they come back. We checked that the gas supply from the gas meter is 22mm, so, without opening the floor, the guess was that it's 22mm all the way to the kitchen, then when the pipe "branch" to gas cooker and boiler (which should be about 1-2 meters from the boiler), it goes to 15mm.

Thanks for the comments

Philippe

 

[doitall]

Not bad Tony, It's Disgusting, I would have ripped the lot out.

As for the Gas pipe, the gezzer may think its ok, The Manufacturers say otherwise, and they are the be all and end all.

 

[doitall]

About that, I think it was properly tested but I will insist also when they come back. We checked that the gas supply from the gas meter is 22mm, so, without opening the floor, the guess was that it's 22mm all the way to the kitchen, then when the pipe "branch" to gas cooker and boiler (which should be about 1-2 meters from the boiler), it goes to 15mm.

You don't say what the total length of the gas pipe is, or the number of bends etc, or what is connected to it other than the boiler.

I wouldn't mind betting it should be 28mm back to the boiler from the cooker.

 

[Agile]

Not bad Tony, It's Disgusting, I would have ripped the lot out.

You are not in a position to rip it out. No one will pay you to replace it!

Its an average job as installers are doing them in London!

If customers go for cheaper quotes from unknown people then that is the standard they are likely to get!

Whilst WB may say a bypass is not necessary, there is no harm in fitting an auto bypass. There is no benefit in having a gate valve and if it were left open it would reduce the efficiency of the boiler.

Tony

 

[doitall]

Thats part of the problem Tony.

That i'll do it works dunnit, and the idiots that pay the bill except it. I'm sorry it ain't good enough.

Make them do the job properly to a decent standard before they get paid, and the CC's and Cowboys may get thinner on the ground

 

[Agile]

Those who know DoItAll will recognise him in this picture dealing with a customer!

Or should that be getting dealt with?

Tony