Adding A radiator....Using the flow circuit only

[TheBigMatt]

Hi All,
i have a Towel Rad in my bathroom. Flow comes down from the ceiling and the Return goes under the floor.

I want to add a small radiator (tall and thin), for various reasons i would like to avoid lifting carpets/floorboards etc. If i were to feed this new rad "inline" with the towel radiator, using only the flow circuit, am i likely to face major problems??

I know that the water in the circuit will be less efficient, but the New Rad would be before the Towel Rail, and i assume it would get properly hot.

The Towel rad would be less hot?? which in fact would be just fine by me.

Anyone ever done this?? Would i only be affecting the one circuit and not the whole system??

advice appreciated....Matt

 

[Bahco]

Can't see how you will get circulation myself

You will be feeding the rad from both ends with the flow pipe

 

[cozzmic]

Usually if its top in, bottom out on a towel rail its off the domestic hot water on a gravity circuit and is not suitable for a steel radiator. Check it out trace the pipe in the loft and see if it connects to the HW cylinder or pipework from it. Its called a secondary loop.

 

[TheBigMatt]

Sorry Guys,

Didn't explain myself.

System was originally (30 years ago) a conventional boiler/tank. Boiler was replaced with a combi (combi is upstairs if it makes a difference...). The bathroom radiator used to run on the Hot water circuit years ago (hence the Pipe Runs), It was replaced with the Towel Radiator..so..

The existing Towel Rad is fed from the top and returns from the bottom.

I was asking if it would be acceptable to pick up the feed before it reaches the Towel Rad and take a "loop" to feed the New rad (pipes from the ceiling).
the return from the new rad would be the Feed of the Towel Rad (make sense???).
I believe that radiators can have feed and return from the same end due to internal pipework??

In effect making the Towel Rad and the New Rad one "unit".

cheers Matt

 

[Bahco]

Will look naff I think

Won't heat up either applying the law of physics

 

[Rob]

Can you not tee into both of the F and R. May require other rads to be balanced but then they would atleast heat up equally.

 

[meldrew's_mate]

System was originally (30 years ago) a conventional boiler/tank. Boiler was replaced with a combi (combi is upstairs if it makes a difference...). The bathroom radiator used to run on the Hot water circuit years ago (hence the Pipe Runs), It was replaced with the Towel Radiator..so..

The existing Towel Rad is fed from the top and returns from the bottom.

Sounds like you want to run two radiators (emitters) in series. Because the system is now pumped this will work, with the second emitter (towel warmer) being cooler than the rad above (?) it.

If I have the mental picture right it would look better with the towel rad higher, n'est pas? Beauty is, of course, in the eye....

 

[TheBigMatt]

Hi Meldrews Mate,

Yes, exactly. I want to run the NEW rad in Series (wished i could have remembered that word....explains things a lot better) BEFORE the Towel Rad.

I was expecting the Towel Rad to be cooler (saves my backside getting blisters..LOL).

In fact the two Emitters will be on separate walls and not next to each other, so the ugly factor is not a problem.

I just wanted to make sure i did not screw up the whole system.

Thanks to everyone for their help..

Matt

 

[Softus]

Usually if its top in, bottom out on a towel rail its off the domestic hot water on a gravity circuit and is not suitable for a steel radiator.

What on earth do you think towel rails are made of?

Check it out trace the pipe in the loft and see if it connects to the HW cylinder or pipework from it. Its called a secondary loop.

Oh really? I think you're very confused.

I want to run the NEW rad in Series (wished i could have remembered that word....explains things a lot better) BEFORE the Towel Rad.

meldrew's_mate is correct - most others not so. Effectively you'll be running the new rad as if it were in a one pipe system. Make sure that you tee off the flow pipe at each valve on the new rad, i.e. don't install the rad in series with the flow pipe, but in parallel with it. That way you can turn the rad down or off when you need to, without it affecting the rest of the rads.

 

[Agile]

I dont think you have understood what he wants to do, Softus!

Quite simply he has a pumped system and want to put a new rad in series with the towel rad. Thats not a problem. Might need a little ballancing but probably just need to lockshield on the towel rad opening a little.

Equally the new rad could be fitted in parallal but that might need more complicated pipework and look a bit untidy.

Tony

 

[Softus]

I dont think you have understood what he wants to do, Softus!

Oh this should be good. I'm in need of a laugh Agile.

Please interpret the following words from the OP:

I was asking if it would be acceptable to pick up the feed before it reaches the Towel Rad and take a "loop" to feed the New rad (pipes from the ceiling).
the return from the new rad would be the Feed of the Towel Rad (make sense???).

...then tell me which of my words imply that I took the wrong interpretation.

 

[Agile]

Effectively you'll be running the new rad as if it were in a one pipe system.

I think that you thought that he wanted to connect the new rad on the flow from the boiler as if it was a "one pipe system".

There is nothing in his garbled posting to suggest that he has anything other than a standard parallel connected heating system with the towel rail as a radiator.

Tony

 

[Softus]

I think that you thought that he wanted to connect the new rad on the flow from the boiler as if it was a "one pipe system".

Not "from the boiler", but "to the existing radiator".

Otherwise, yes - I do think that this is what he wants to do.

There is nothing in his garbled posting to suggest that he has anything other than a standard parallel connected heating system with the towel rail as a radiator.

IMHO his existing system is irrelevant. Whatever the route of the flow to his existing towel warmer might be, he can avoid all potential problems by connecting the new rad in parallel with that flow, not in series with it.

 

[TheBigMatt]

Hi All,

Firstly, let me apologise if my inaccurate posting/description had caused any of you to take up cudgels with each other.

Secondly, i am really grateful for all the replies.

SOFTUS..thanks for your idea about connecting in parallel

However, if i do connect in parallel, will i not get a "short circuit" across the IN & OUT of the new rad?? What is to stop the Flow trying to get down the OUT of the new rad and just locking up the circulation in the rad??

Should i fit some kind of a check valve to prevent this??

Will the OUT (or return) of the new rad have enough flow/pressure to rejoin the flow to the towel rad??

Advice appreciated.

Matt

 

[Softus]

...if i do connect in parallel, will i not get a "short circuit" across the IN & OUT of the new rad?

Given that one pipe systems are usually distributed in 22mm (or greater), then it's possible that it won't be perfect, but I don't understand what you mean by a short circuit.

What is to stop the Flow trying to get down the OUT of the new rad and just locking up the circulation in the rad?

Now you really have lost me.

Should i fit some kind of a check valve to prevent this?

No.

Will the OUT (or return) of the new rad have enough flow/pressure to rejoin the flow to the towel rad?

I don't think you've understood, so I feel a diagram coming on.