And What About The Human Rights Of The Victims?

[securespark]

F'in ridiculous.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...s-he-would-be-persecuted-in-home-country.html

 

[EFLImpudence]

Don't start them off.

 

[Doggit]

You know this'll just turn in to another Brexit justification, don't you. But you're damn right, it's always the supposed human rights of the offenders that seem to be given more credence.

 

[JohnD]

"Rejecting his application, Judge Mott ruled there was no evidence of him being held unlawfully or unreasonably at any time during the period he was detained and his case failed ''on all grounds''."

And you're complaining?

 

[Doggit]

Essentially, you're right John, and for once, common sense prevailed. But it's because criminals use the human rights legislation in their favour, and the judges invariably then take their side, that we're in the current Brexit fiasco.

 

[JohnD]

invariably

Obviously not.

Don't believe everything you read in the papers.

Remember who drafted the Convention.

 

[EFLImpudence]

It might be a deterrent to say behave yourself or we'll send you back anyway - just the same as your human rights will be withheld if imprisoned.

 

[JohnD]

your human rights will be withheld

You're thinking of privileges, but we're talking about rights.

If you think you are entitled to take away someone's rights to a fair trial, not to be tortured, not to be imprisoned or executed without trial, and not to be enslaved, you haven't grasped the concept of human rights.

 

[EFLImpudence]

If you think you are entitled to take away someone's rights to a fair trial, not to be tortured, not to be imprisoned or executed without trial, and not to be enslaved, you haven't grasped the concept of human rights.

We're not going to do any of those.

If sending them home because of their abuse of others results in that, perhaps they may chose to avoid it.

 

[JohnD]

We're not going to do any of those.

But you just said

your human rights will be withheld

What do you think the "human rights" are?

 

[EFLImpudence]

You're thinking of privileges, but we're talking about rights.

Yes, I do feel privileged never having been sent to prison - or perhaps there is a reason that that is the case.

 

[EFLImpudence]

But you just said



What do you think the "human rights" are?

I have broached the subject before where, in these arguments about human rights, the fact that someone can have their right to freedom and all that goes with that taken away (withheld) does not seem to count.

You may have a special term for it but that does not change the fact.

 

[JohnD]

Have a look at the convention.

Tell me which rights you want to take away, at your own whim.

3 Convention articles

• 3.1 Article 1 - respecting rights
• 3.2 Article 2 - life
• 3.3 Article 3 - torture
• 3.4 Article 4 - servitude
• 3.5 Article 5 - liberty and security
• 3.6 Article 6 - fair trial
• 3.7 Article 7 - retroactivity
• 3.8 Article 8 - privacy
• 3.9 Article 9 - conscience and religion
• 3.10 Article 10 - expression
• 3.11 Article 11 - association
• 3.12 Article 12 - marriage
• 3.13 Article 13 - effective remedy
• 3.14 Article 14 - discrimination
• 3.15 Article 15 - derogations
• 3.16 Article 16 - aliens
• 3.17 Article 17 - abuse of rights
• 3.18 Article 18 - permitted restrictions

 

[EFLImpudence]

To save me a bit of time, as it's nearly bed-time, which one contains:

"You may abuse others in the country which has given you refuge, safe in the knowledge that you won't be returned whence you came because there they care as little or even less than you."

 

[JohnD]

3.3 and 3.6