Baxi Barcelona Lockout

[SueDenim]

Just found your forum and feel a sense of deja vu reading the posts - my Barcelona is about five years old and after years of various types of lockout, sonic booms, cycling, as described by many of you, has just gone into ''no reset lockout" - green light on, no reds. House cooling rapidly. Worked through the manual troubleshooting to wind up at "replace control pcb".
Baxi help-line now useless - won't speak to you unless you're CORGI registered.
Any recommendations for where to get the control pcb - and to ensure I get the newest version?
Strangely comforting to know we're not alone...

 

[Howard]

Have just read a post from uncleben which says Baxi have a responsibility reagrding its boilers for six years. Can anyone give me more information.My three year old Barcelona has had a new pcb, a new circuit board, a new gas valve and seal since Christmas. Thank God for British Gas 3* service contract. I've no desire to become famous for five minutes but perhaps one of the other members of our sad Baxitis club would like to contact bbc.co.uk/watchdog! It's outrageous that Baxi continue to sell this boiler under another name and that they have never been held accountable for being in breach of the Trade Descriptions Act which states that good must be suitable for the purpose they were intended.

 

[Howard]

I'm like a dog with a bone when I get started! Have just emailed Watchdog with my thoughts regarding Baxi. Why don't some of you do it too? bbc.co.uk/watchdog. You don't have to volunteer to be filmed, but one of the questions they ask after you've written your email is whether you have any objection to them contacting Baxi. Sounds a good idea to me! The more complaints Watchdog gets the more likely they are to take Baxi to task on our behalf. As they say in the North East "shy bairns get nought"!

 

[shaneo]

i went to install my uncle a boiler the other day, turned up and funny thing was, he was standing there with a big smile on his face looking all prowed with his new potterton condencing boiler sitting next to him, stright bk to the shop it went, ended up with a worcester non condencing

ill foot the extra gas bill, for a reliable boiler any day

 

[kevplumb]

as they in the north east marra if you dont SHOUT you dont get bonny lad

 

[RobTom]

I read this site with interest after my 3rd set of trouble with early Baxi HE100. Swedish Viking & others seem to have it covered about intermittent lockout;-
1.Early ignition PCBs did have dry joints which fail just outside warranty ( easy fix & mucho brownie points with beloved).
2.Phantom condensate faults; ie condensate trap fills with alu-oxide slurry which deposits on the inside of the case & gives false sensor "faults" where it tracks around the case to earth. Condensate trap weir heights are too close to the sensor electrode screws & water splash can cause trips ( empty trap every 3months in winter to avoid this ). The sensor wire is connected to the ignition PCB & it was worth investigating the sensor/trap before buying a new PCB.

My 3rd problem was 10 days ago when the unit would ignite from cold with the healthy "whirr,clic,clic,clic…(wait5secs)….clic,wumpf" of the gas valve & ignition working.
But once it had cycled & ran until correct temp reached, it switched off & would not re-ignite. All you could hear was "whirr,clic,clic,clic…(wait5secs)……(nothing)" five times & then go to ignition lockout.
- I could manually reset this with the control knob but had to leave it switched off for a while before retrying due to how hot the PCB gets in the control box.

I followed the fault finding chart in the manual, which was technically correct though still a bit vague, got the the spark electrodes renewed, cleaned sooty control box & eventually renewed the ignition pcb ( though not entirely convinced as it would still spark from cold ).
Before installation I did compare the 2 PCBs ( same part #) & the new one has different ( black opaque) relays & resistor values. I figure this is BAXI refining the design to reduce the sensitivity of the condensate lockout which appears to be the root of all this evil.

I now have a warm wife, happy house & a slightly worn PCB. Good luck to you all.

 

[Panjandrum]

After I failed to spell Barcelona right in my first search - finding nothing - I have found this lot
My Barcelona has been through some of these problems but each time they were fixed by the guys I called out - mostly under warranty. Door seals replaced again at last service in October.
This year's problem is like SueDenim's - getting cold, boiler asleep with green light, pump working, valves open.
If I turn off for about ten minutes it starts working again and keeps going for hours before repeating.
It has done this twice. Last time I turned down the knob on the boiler a bit and it has been OK since.
I don't think the problem has been cured though - any news SueDenim?
I will be calling my service guys again today and any info very welcome.

 

[ScottandSue]

In late 1999 I had a completely new heating and hot water system installed - requiring around 150,000 BTUs. The heating company installed two Baxi Barcelona’s.

The boilers have been problematic since installation - with countless services and repairs, running into hundreds of pounds. I am told the boilers are not worth repairing anymore – after only 5 years.

Since installation they have ‘exploded’ on ignition – this has never been resolved properly. They require constant servicing - and have a persistent problem of going into “reset mode”. The repairs to the boilers include – new circuit board, new burners, new traps (3 times), new electrodes and seals (every time). The last repair cost me over £250, and it took only three weeks for the ‘reset and banging’ issues to return.

Baxi say the Barcelona has been superseded by the ProMAX – using the same technology but erradicating the problems. However, I am concerned about making the same mistake twice - and have been advised to avoid Baxi Potterton altogether - and to use Vaillant instead.

Any views/feedback greatly appreciated.

 

[PEDANTICVINDICTIVEMAN]

If something I buy turns out to be a pile of s***I tell as many people as possible everywhere I go and NEVER buy that make again no matter how they try to rebadge, British Leyland springs to mind, got caught out with a Morris Marina and later on a Rover 2300, I have made a vow never to buy a Rover or anything related to these group of companies, my money goes on foreign cars and has done for years now, I have a long memory when I feel the piiss has been taken wether it be a boiler, car, or whatever.
VOTE WITH YOUR WALLET. Oh yea I wont buy from Network Q again either, bunch of t****s renaged on there 30 day money back gaurantee or tried to, picked the wrong customer to try it on with me though, car warrantys aint worth the paper there written on.

 

[Panjandrum]

Since I turned the knob on my Barcelona down - from about 11o'clock to about 9 o'clock - I have had no problems at all.
I am still a bit anxious about the "green light on but boiler never coming on" problem that I had a few days ago. Is there a nasty problem lurking in there or should I cancel next week's visit from "The Gasman"?

 

[gasman1234567892001]

sownd like the hige temp stat is not working. try replace

 

[MrCrossFromCardiff]

I'm about to get my 6th pair of PCBs for my Barcelona which I purchased in September 1999. The original ones were replaced in Novmber 1999 due to the grunting and explosion problems made reference to within this forum. All the remainder were fitted (March 2002, January 2003, November 2003) for ignition lockout - constant red light.

There are many interesting observations and histories. My own pet theory for some of the problem is the design of the PCB box. It interests me that there is no active cooling for the electronics, in a module which sits adjacent to a fire generating 70KW! Has anyone felt the heat sink on the control PCB when it's running? It can be too hot to touch. Look at the active cooling on a modern PC which is consuming, what, 500 watts! They have fans all over the place. The overheating first struck me when I noticed it was always following a cold spell, when I turned up the boiler stat, that I got failure of the boards. The boiler would run o.k once it was lit, but ignition lockout pretty much followed a short period of high activity.

I have just shelled out £235 for Baxi to come to fix my current problem.
Actually, it was working when the fitter arrived this morning (lockout is intermittent), and he left it hard down, expecting to return with new PCBs, wiring loom, and gas valve 48 hours later! You've got to laugh! Of course I will attempt to claw the finance back, but it doesn't help the sanity, knowing the likelyhood is another failure in around 12 months.

Anyone know a good therapist?

 

[croydoncorgi]

Yup - there's dog's ... as in Mutt's Nut's,
and dogs.

you've clearly got the second type.
Unfortunately, every boiler manufacturer in UK seems to have one (at least!).
Your point about high temperature getting to the PCB SHOULD have occurred to Baxi by now. As should the fact that the plastic cage around the PCB's get's 'tracked' near the HT components on the ignition board and tends to weaken the ignition spark or carry it straight to earth.
But strangely they have not done much about either problem, AFAIK!

 

[MrCrossFromCardiff]

I bought a shower fan at the weekend. When Baxi have done their stuff tomorrow, I'm going to wire it in sync with the pump, and point it at the electronics cage.

Anyone tried fitting a fan?

 

[SwedishViking2]

In answer to a slight slur... There are two issues with the early boards which can be described as Faulty Board Logic :

1. On the early units from 1999 (I was one of the first to buy one as it was dirt cheap - false economy but there you go) the unit would first fire up then check the water temp in the system and then turn off if more heat was not required. That is CRAP design by anyones standard and was subsequently changed by Baxi to first test the water temp and then fire the unit when needed which resulted in a more quite unit. This mod should save on electrode life... + as it had explosive start MY NERVES! Check the very old flow chart - if you can get hold of one - with the new one and you will see what I mean.

2. According to the BAXI Engineer (who fixed the problem permanently ??? 18 months ago), the later PCBs has been made more fault tolerant and will not react to intermittent "fault conditions" which subsequently clear. I do not know what technique they used but it would something like "double knock" or a longer time interval to ensure the fault condition is really there and did not clear.

UNLESS , THEY JUST CHANGED IT ALL FOR FUN BECAUSE THEY WERE SO HAPPY WITH A WELL WORKING UNIT AND THE PHONE WITH CUSTOMER COMPLAINTS WAS COLLECTING DUST IN A CORNER...

3. As for the Screws, this is a new one to me. Must have been sleeping during the physics lessons .

4. Also, because I forgot it earlier , A BIG CREDIT to the female engineer who very quickly and efficiently repaired the unit after both her Baxi male colleagues and other cowboys failed


Best Regards Swedish Viking