covid, vaccines, risk

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

So, did you suffer a blood clot or die as a result - thought not. Why all the fuss then, why so negative?

So Bobby, how do you recommend minimising a (n alleged) risk of say, 100 (maybe extra) blood clots in 17 million vaccinations?

This is where your Howard/Paxman strategy comes apart at the seams. Specifically: I was jabbed Wednesday. What exactly should I have done before attending, in order to minimise the risk? I'm 64.

There's a bushfire approaching. You can escape by going across this bridge. There is a strong wind potentially severe enough to blow you completely off the bridge.
I would argue that people ought to be made aware of that risk, so that they can take precautions, but to cross and be aware of the risk from the wind.
You would argue that people should not be made aware of that risk and just persuade them to cross, telling them there is no risk, because the risk of being burnt is too severe to consider any alternative risks.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

I would argue that people ought to be made aware of that risk, so that they can take precautions, but to cross and be aware of the risk from the wind.
You would argue that people should not be made aware of that risk and just persuade them to cross, telling them there is no risk, because the risk of being burnt is too severe to consider any alternative risks.

Getting out of bed on a morning, presents its own risks, but what we are discussing here is a very, very tiny risk, versus a very real and obvious risk. It's no contest so far as I am concerned.

 

[JohnD]

Just shows that Macron knew exactly what he was doing.

Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity

 

[ajohn]

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
If everyone is aware of any associated risk, it can be minimised.
To deny any risk exists is to aggravate any risk.

Your completely ignoring the number of people who have been vaccinated. This makes no higher than normal rates far far more solid evidence that the problem is not related to the vaccine. Similar can be done against other vaccines providing the number of people who have had it are accounted for

Over all this is interesting actually as generally it would take a lot longer to gather similar information on any new medical treatment.. Huge number help so instead of taking many years results can be considered much much earlier - due to the shear number it also makes comparison with normal rates far easier and more reliable.

You might say it's the only good thing about covid. Same with treatments. Plenty of patients to try them on and get statistically significant results over shorter time scales. Even the period to death isn't onerously long.

 

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

Your completely ignoring the number of people who have been vaccinated.

I'm not, and it's not my findings. I'm relating the findings of WHO and EMA. They both state that the benefits outweigh the risks.
The MHRA deny the existence of any risk.
The incidences of blood clots occurred in an age group that would not normally be susceptible to such issues.
Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
If one is aware of the risk, one can mitigate it. If the existence of that risk is denied, then it cannot be mitigated.
As seen in my burning bridge analogy, it is wise to be aware of any potential risk so that it can be mitigated.
Mitigating a risk is not always achieved before the event. It can be achieved after the event, but only if you are aware of it.
If you are not aware of the risk, either before or after, you will not reduce the risk.

 

[durhamplumber]

There's a bushfire approaching. You can escape by going across this bridge. There is a strong wind potentially severe enough to blow you completely off the bridge.
I would argue that people ought to be made aware of that risk, so that they can take precautions, but to cross and be aware of the risk from the wind.
You would argue that people should not be made aware of that risk and just persuade them to cross, telling them there is no risk, because the risk of being burnt is too severe to consider any alternative risks.

Dangler has lost his marbles altogether...Dopy Analogy time.

 

[durhamplumber]

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

All that crap can be applied to Santa Claus...Pixies..God..etc...It is meaningless word play

 

[durhamplumber]

Your completely ignoring the number of people who have been vaccinated. This makes no higher than normal rates far far more solid evidence that the problem is not related to the vaccine. Similar can be done against other vaccines providing the number of people who have had it are accounted for

Great points well made.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

All that crap can be applied to Santa Claus...Pixies..God..etc...It is meaningless word play

It's almost as if he is regretting having had the jab, rather than promoting it as the solution that it is.

 

[ajohn]

You are - end of as far as I am concerned. Your concentrated on the covid against vaccine end effects statistics and ignoring the rest. They are bound to mention the odds people have who have been vaccinated and those that haven't as it is another factor. So go ahead and ignore the fact that statistically rates are no different to what they would normally get. Given the numbers of people who have been vaccinated that is very significant . Your essentially being pedantic just for the sake of it. You have these moments at times.

Anyway Uk take up looks to be heading to 93% of all age groups that are offered it. The cohorts that have been completed are at that level and latest lot are increasing at similar rates as it's being dolled out.

 

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

Great points well made.

Have you not learned how to use the tanks and like functions yet?
You've been using this forum for nearly eleven years, I'd have thought you'd have learnt by now.
Or did you not have anything to say, but felt you had to say something?

 

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

Dangler has lost his marbles altogether...Dopy Analogy time.

I know you have difficulty understanding analogies, you don't need to constantly display your idiocy.

 

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

It's almost as if he is regretting having had the jab, rather than promoting it as the solution that it is.

You're as bad as lower and dumberplum deducing your nonsense from my reasonable comments.

 

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

All that crap can be applied to Santa Claus...Pixies..God..etc...It is meaningless word play

It will be meaningless to anyone with your low intellectual ability.

 

[durhamplumber]

I know you have difficulty understanding analogies, you don't need to constantly display your idiocy.

It is nonsense from beginning to end...Like many many analogies.