I wonder if a diyer who causes death from the work would receive a punishment as harsh as a registered guy who did the same?, diyer would have the defence of ignorance wheras the gas reg guy would only have negigence.
DIY gas
- Thread starter geoff@cetltd
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By showing their accreditation to the relevant bodies. by referencing previous work that has since been signed off or test drive by othersending over the years.
They would also likely have insurance, which although in itself would not be any defence, would all go toward demonstrating the competence of the individual and this as an isolated incident. custodial sentence likely, but unlikely to be as harsh as that handed to somebody who should have known better than to undertake work usually carried out by gas safe registered engineers.
If people are that sure of themselves they feel they can do their own gas work without being gas safe registered or having completed any such courses, then I doubt they will take any notice of postings on Internet forums advising against it.
My wife and kids sleep in this house, and although I'm competent at most things, and "probably" could do gas, it's just not worth the risk. I'd rather get somebody who comes recommended and has been doing it for years with all the right knowledge.
Ignorance is not a defence.
That relates to ignorance of the law but there is no law preventing diy gas work. It would be ignorance of procedure......anyway, was just wondering.
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Would that not call into question the accreditation process of the relevant bodies. One of their accreditted trades people created a hazardous or lethal situation.
You quite quite easily be a member of gas safe and have done all your exams, and then do something negligent or incompetent which causes an acccident.
If prosecuted, the court would be deciding if you were competent - not deciding if you were a member of gas safe or not.
If prosecuted, the court would be deciding if you were competent - not deciding if you were a member of gas safe or not.
Yeah, that'll go down well. Lets try that in a different context ...
"Yes Mr Plod, I know you say I was driving like a complete and utter t**t, and that's why my car is now wrapped round that tree. Yes, and I realise you are saying I'm incompetent as a driver, but this 'ere licence and membership of RoSPA/IAM says I am competent". Hmm, can't see that working too well.
Ah, so you are suggesting that previous (good) work is a way of showing competence ?
I notice you are all ignoring the questions I asked a few posts ago
SimonH2, as I see it, your argument for diy gas work rests on the fact that the law does not forbid it if the person undertaking it is competent. The law, however, is open to interpretation. What is unclear is how the word competent is defined. In the case of employees and self employed, competence is defined as we have seen but for diy it is not. What is needed is competence to be defined in relation to diy gas work. Occasionally laws need clarifying in order that everyone understands what is and is not permissable. This can be done through courts by way of a test case which sets a precedent for future cases. If a diyer undertakes gas work and causes an accident then they will, by outcome, have shown themselves not to be competent and should expect to fall foul of the law as it stands. What is needed is a case where someone has undertaken diy gas work and nothing has gone wrong. Does this mean that by virtue of nothing going wrong they were,therefore, competent and acting legally or that they should have been able to demonstrate competence in some way before starting the work?
I would be very happy to have the Gas Safe Register use the fees I pay them to bring such a test case in order that the law be clarified. If you would be willing to supply the GSR with your name and address and a list of diy gas work you have undertaken without incident, I will lobby the GSR to take out a case against you on behalf of their members. Purely to clarify the legal position you understand. Nothing personal.
I suspect you will not take advantage of this opportunity so would urge you to seek clarification on how other bodies would interpret the law. I suggest you ring up your household insurance company and inform them of the diy gas work you undertake. I can imagine how that conversation would go.
I would be very happy to have the Gas Safe Register use the fees I pay them to bring such a test case in order that the law be clarified. If you would be willing to supply the GSR with your name and address and a list of diy gas work you have undertaken without incident, I will lobby the GSR to take out a case against you on behalf of their members. Purely to clarify the legal position you understand. Nothing personal.
I suspect you will not take advantage of this opportunity so would urge you to seek clarification on how other bodies would interpret the law. I suggest you ring up your household insurance company and inform them of the diy gas work you undertake. I can imagine how that conversation would go.
It was 30 years ago but I did just that when we self built a house. The underwriters asked a few questions and based on the honest answers I gave accepted the risk and insured the property
As far I'm aware (I wasn't in the industry then and can't be arsed googling it) there was no requirement for anyone to be registered 30 years ago. CORGI was a voluntary scheme originally. I suspect you'd get a different response these days.
I'm very interested in your interpretation. I believe that the law forbids someone working as a gasman if he is not a competent person. Do you think there is a law that forbids someone from repairing his own gas appliance in his own home, not as a job? If so, what is this law?
Well Simon I hope you sleep well and I hope your family sleep safe,but if anything happens and god forbid it doesn't.I hope you remember what you've been told.if anything happens to your family
it's not the courts you need to worry about it's your concscience which will prick you every day
for the rest of your life.
it's not the courts you need to worry about it's your concscience which will prick you every day
for the rest of your life.
3.—(1) No person shall carry out any work in relation to a gas fitting or gas storage vessel unless he is competent to do so.
This part of the law applies to everyone, registered or diy. The clarification needed is how competency is defined for the diyer. We know how its defined for the tradesman.
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The only definition of qualification I can see is 3.3, for an employed or self-employed person, "a member of a class of persons approved for the time being by the Health and Safety Executive for the purposes of this paragraph."
I have read this document. I can find no reference to penalties for failure to comply.
Presuming that penalties exist, what is the law that specifies what they are, and when they may be applied? Perhaps that will help.
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Not sure what your point is John. The section of the law that some on this thread are using to justify diy gas work requires that the person undertaking the work be competent. What is not specified and needs clarification is what defines competence for the diyer. As for penalties for failure to comply; I don't know, there may not be any. The only part of the legislation I have quoted is that used by others to support their argument. They have suggested it is unambiguous. I disagree.
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