Dover...

[Deleted member 174758]

This would have happened whether or not we were still in the EU. There have always been passport checks at Dover, and if the one side doesn't put on enough staff to cope with the load, there will be delays.

The "check" was often just a cursory glance at your passport. Now we have left the EU the 3rd country rules apply, so the French staff have to stamp your passport, check that you aren't re-entering within 90 days of the last 90 day period you were there, check that you have sufficient money to live on for the duration, check that you have a return or onward ticket or the wherewithal to purchase one. That takes somewhat longer, and is pretty much the same procedure I went through every time I travelled from the UK to the Netherlands and Germany back in the 1970s before I got my Dutch Verbleifsvergunning (residency permit). So Brexit has rolled us back some 40 years..... And all because Tories cannot understand that the rules apply to everyone

 

[IT Minion]

I’ve been through places where they just look at your passport or put it in a machine. I’ve also been through places where they look at your passport or put it through a machine and then stamp it. The latter always seems to take just two seconds longer. I can’t see that stamping a passport once you’ve inspected it can account for major delay's. Try it. Open a book, inspect the page and just before you close the book, thump your fist on the table and then thump the open page. See!

As far as I can remember in 'normal' times, at the start of most school breaks (but the summer break in particular), there’s always been motorway traffic jams as well as port and airport queues and delays. Add in the fact that not many people have been abroad for the last couple of years and a few scoundrels 'accidentally' turning up late for work and there was always going to be an increase in delays for travellers at the start of this summer break. It happens with holidays the same as it happens on the roads every morning and every evening. It’s called the rush hour. We should be used to it by now.

Now they need to read it if they're doing it properly. They should be checking that you haven't been overstaying in Europe and adding up the days you've spent there. Otherwise they are letting in illegal immigrants.

That never happened before.

Edit: ninja'd by JobandKnock

 

[Notch7]

There are alternatives, and i predict that in the next couple of years there will be substantial changes to the protocol

Please stop being dishonest, there are no alternatives

The EU are playing hardball at the moment and claiming there are no alternatives, but there are and things will change

there are no alternatives.

What will happen is NI will become increasingly aligned with the single market -businesses are rapidly moving to new suppliers and new markets....and after a few years trade with GB will have dropped so much the protocol become largely irrelevant.


The EU are not playing hardball, they have been generous -they have allowed UK to unilaterally extend the grace period, more than once

 

[Notch7]

Edit: ninja'd by JobandKnock

 

[Notch7]

The "check" was often just a cursory glance at your passport. Now we have left the EU the 3rd country rules apply, so the French staff have to stamp your passport, check that you aren't re-entering within 90 days of the last 90 day period you were there, check that you have sufficient money to live on for the duration, check that you have a return or onward ticket or the wherewithal to purchase one. That takes somewhat longer, and is pretty much the same procedure I went through every time I travelled from the UK to the Netherlands and Germany back in the 1970s before I got my Dutch Verbleifsvergunning (residency permit). So Brexit has rolled us back some 40 years..... And all because Tories cannot understand that the rules apply to everyone

before they barely bothered checking passports

and its not just one check per car -the passport of every occupant has to be checked

and each passport has to be stamped -its the only way to know the length of stay

 

[Mottie]

Please stop being dishonest, there are no alternatives

I know people who have been to Spain and have NOT had their passport stamped so complacency is already creeping in.

I can remember some on here saying we'd be f'cked and there would be no alternatives to:

Loss of the EHIC
The need for Green card insurance
UK photo driving licence not being valid in the EU
Loss of inclusive mobile roaming for U.K. citizens
The need for a visa for U.K. citizens to enter the EU.

All turned out to be just a part of project fear.

 

[IT Minion]

I can remember some on here saying we'd be f'cked and there would be no alternatives to:

Loss of the EHIC
The need for Green card insurance
UK photo driving licence not being valid in the EU
Loss of inclusive mobile roaming for U.K. citizens
The need for a visa for U.K. citizens to enter the EU.

All turned out to be just a part of project fear.

Anyone seen the goalposts? They were around here somewhere.

If we don't have freedom of movement then the delays at Eurotunnel and Dover are going to remain brutal, even when they're operating at peak efficiency, like on Saturday.

 

[Lower]

Please stop being dishonest, there are no alternatives


there are no alternatives.

What will happen is NI will become increasingly aligned with the single market -businesses are rapidly moving to new suppliers and new markets....and after a few years trade with GB will have dropped so much the protocol become largely irrelevant.


The EU are not playing hardball, they have been generous -they have allowed UK to unilaterally extend the grace period, more than once

The accusation of being dishonest is the pot calling the kettle black.

There are plenty of alternative ways of doing things:

A hard border in Ireland is an alternative
A hard border between Ireland and the EU is an alternative
The UK fully aligning on standards is an alternative.
The UK proposals for not checking goods destined for NI is alternative.
Unilaterally changing the the protocol as per article 16 is an alternative.

The narrative of there being no alternatives is just the EU's party line. Either side may not like the alternatives, but they exist.

I don't accept that a UK government of either red of blue, will allow the trade with NI to ultimately disappear in the way you describe, even if that means invoking article 16 and risking a trade war because that would probably be the first step to a possible reunification of Ireland and the resumption of hostilities.

 

[Mottie]

Anyone seen the goalposts? They were around here somewhere.

Do you mean those goalposts that we were told were set in stone and couldn’t be moved?

If we don't have freedom of movement then the delays at Eurotunnel and Dover are going to remain brutal, even when they're operating at peak efficiency, like on Saturday.

They were not operating at peak efficiency on Saturday. They were operating at above above normal peak capacity.
We don’t make our roads three times as wide or double the fleet of busses and trains just to cope with rush hour as it would be expensive to build and maintain for the rest of the time. We just have to accept delays at peak times. It’s been happening for years, long before Brexit.

Ever seen the queue for the ladies at the interval at the theatre?

 

[Lower]

before they barely bothered checking passports

and its not just one check per car -the passport of every occupant has to be checked

and each passport has to be stamped -its the only way to know the length of stay

Doesn't the computer scan they do of the passport (all passports, not just 3rd countries) log the travel in and the travel out as well as the stamp?

 

[ellal]

Maybe even you or one of yours too then.

For myself and partner that has already happened, but something you refuse to recognise even though you were one of the architects of the brexit farce...

As for our children, they can come and go as they please and have no restrictions on freedom of movement in 30 countries for whatever reason and for however long they like...

How about your children/grand children?

Do they have the same opportunities?

 

[JBR]

you're telling me that in your opinion, our ex-employees should lose their pensions?

We should pay them, not pay the EU to pay them - and no doubt skim some off for themselves.

 

[JBR]

what are you talking about?

EFFECTIVE control of our Border Farce, by virtue of our own government.

 

[JBR]

the UK's public servants are employed by the UK.

Your government (still headed by untrustworthy liar Johnson) sets out the laws under which they operate.

Which UK laws are you objecting to?

Exactly! I'm blaming our government for allowing the Civil Service and others to work in favour of the EU.

 

[Mottie]

For myself and partner that has already happened, but something you refuse to recognise even though you were one of the architects of the brexit farce...

As for our children, they can come and go as they please and have no restrictions on freedom of movement in 30 countries for whatever reason and for however long they like...

How about your children/grand children?

Do they have the same opportunities?

Our son-in-law has dual nationality - American and British. He has no problem going back and forth to the USA. Can yours? Do they want to? No. Neither do ours want to do that in Europe. It’s not the big deal you make it out to be.