Drop kerb and existing hard standing - planning / neighbour issues and then some

Discussion in 'Building Regulations and Planning Permission' started by flintandsteel, 4 Jul 2016.

  1. flintandsteel

    flintandsteel

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    1st post so hopefully in the right place.

    My neighbour submitted a planning application (with fees) and a drop kerb application about 7 years ago.
    Whatever happened, the planning application was never approved as she failed to respond to (possible) queries from the Council and eventually it all ran out of time and was closed.
    However the proposed parking bay / hard standing was constructed and conforms to required standards with a deep free draining permeable gravel surface atop a hard core base (the sloping site was levelled off).
    Q? Would / could this require official "regularisation" so long after its construction?
    Q? Did it ever really require Planning Permission?

    As for the drop kerb submission (with fees paid) I was informed that a Highways officer had visited the site and approved the drop kerb submission subject to it being done by one of their nominated contractors and within 6 months of approval. Officers don't turn up unless completed and paid forms are submitted prior to a site inspection. Again it ran out of time.
    Q? Is approval of a drop kerb a sort of Planning approval but under the jurisdiction of the Highways authority? Certainly a member of their staff described it as such, but is it really?
    or
    Q? Does it require 2 approvals together to undertake and complete this work?

    My reasons for asking
    1) My neighbour has been using my parking area on my land and now refuses to vacate the area.
    2) She states she "doesn't have planning approval so can't use her own space on her own land !!
    3) I'd say she once had approval and neglected to tell me (as per terms of the agreement) and she bottled out of completing and paying for the dropping of the kerb as it was cheaper and easier for her to stay put on my land.
    4) Is it realistic to consider that the agreement between us actually ended once Highways gave their consent?

    Your thoughts would be appreciated.
    My thanks
     
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  3. Nakajo

    Nakajo

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    Is there by any chance more going on here than meets the eye.
     
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  4. ^woody^

    ^woody^

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    A hard standing does not need any permission.

    Dropped kerbs are not a planning concern unless on a classified road - eg a main road normally.
     
  5. flintandsteel

    flintandsteel

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    No hidden agenda, pretty much as I laid out above.
    Basically I've done her a favour for 8+ years and now I'm selling my house.
    Looks like I'll either have to drop the price or find a solution hence writing here.
    The crucial phrase in the agreement refers to Planning Permission as in once obtained then the agreement ceases.
    So the existing hard standing doesn't require PP, leaving only the drop kerb to resolve and the contractors to pay.
    Yes the drop kerb is on a main road, access agreed in 2009 and ran out of time (or maybe money) to follow through and complete it.
    I've offered to pay for required submissions and 50% of kerb costs. No response.
    What more can I do?

    Just got this from my local County Authority site
    So I do need a separate PP for accessing the site.

    Do I need planning permission for a vehicle dropped crossing?
    It is likely that you will need planning permission from your local district council or national park authority if the vehicular crossing:

    • Accesses an A, B or C classified road (access our online maps to see this information);
    • Passes over non-highways land e.g. land which is registered as village green or common land;
    • Is for a property other than a house for a single family e.g. housing, commercial or industrial development; or
    • Works are being done inside the site.
    Planning permission is not usually required if the access is onto an unclassified road (access our online maps to see this information), but might still be needed if the access forms part of more extensive works. You should check with your local district council or national park authority.
     
    Last edited: 5 Jul 2016
  6. magicmushroom666

    magicmushroom666

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  7. flintandsteel

    flintandsteel

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    Ah! Forgot to say that her hard standing is on her ground to the side of the house and accessing (potentially) the main road. My parking area is to the back of my house with separate access. She's just a stubborn **$%$^&^&$" who refuses to move. Hell, it would only be a small inconvenience for her in the short term.
    Will wait for copies of the original submissions then see.
    It may be that she can be got on "lack of intention to comply with the agreement". i's looking Legal !! :(
     
  8. Nakajo

    Nakajo

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    Just to clarify, which of those bullet points do you tick?
     
  9. geraldthehamster

    geraldthehamster

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    If she is parking on your land (that is, land that you own), can't you just install a lockable barrier to stop her parking there? Like posts and a chain?

    Cheers
    Richard
     
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  11. flintandsteel

    flintandsteel

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    Not that simple as the agreement states "when PP is obtained". It was supposed to be a short term fix till her space became free as it was a building site when she bought it. The puzzling part is that she paid for and applied for PP & drop kerb in 2009 but never completed on them. That's why after all this time I'm now hoping I can get her on lack of intention to re-submit and complete.
    All very tricky.
    Perhaps we should leave it here.
    Thank you for all the input.
     
  12. I'm struggling a bit to understand this. You've mentioned several times an agreement but have failed to describe the nature and form of this 'agreement'. Perhaps you could go into a bit more detail about this agreement and someone may be able to help you get your neighbour off your land.
     
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  13. RichA

    RichA

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  14. geraldthehamster

    geraldthehamster

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    Yes, what is this "agreement"? Unless it's some kind of legal contract I don't see the problem.
     
  15. SimonH2

    SimonH2

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    Oops, that wasn't such a good idea in hindsight. "earliest of obtaining permission or a fixed end date" would have been more sensible.
    It may be that she realised that by not completing, she gets to park on your land "forever".
    As above, it might be a good idea to post the text of the agreement, otherwise no-one here has any idea what terms were agreed.
     
  16. oldbutnotdead

    oldbutnotdead

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    So your neighbour has a written contract with you stating that she can park on your land until she gets round to sorting her own dropped kerb/parking arrangements? Is this written into the deeds (ie does it show on land registry) or is it a freestanding contract?

    I think you need to be talking to a solicitor. In a rational world you would be able to give her notice that that temporary agreement (from the sound of it it was obviously intended to be temporary) is now coming to an end. If you have evidence to back up your assertion regarding the dropped kerb approval (if I remember from mine, the application costs £50 or similar, if approved and you use the councils' highways team then you get the £50 back) then that might help, along with the pp sketch.

    As someone else said, you could apply for pp for the scheme yourself- if it is granted then you're laughing since your contract would then lapse- might be the cheapest way out and

    And next time you do someone a favour, charge rent (even 1p a year) and put annual break clauses into the contract. Lucky you're moving- a few more years unchallenged and she could try an adverse possession or customary use land grab- she might try that anyway.
     
  17. SimonH2

    SimonH2

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    She could try, but unless the land owner is really clueless and doesn't take any advice the application would fall flat on it's face. Adverse possession cannot be given where the use is with permission - the whole point is that you have to have been using the land, without permission, and unchallenged, for a whole 10 years. Even then it's not over - when you apply, the Land Registry will write to any registered owners, and they have 2 years to object before possession is granted.
    Yes, I looked into this a few years ago :whistle:
     
  18. DIYnot Local

    DIYnot Local

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