Finding potential lethal c*ck ups from previous owners

[kevsterdiy]

Hi I have a couple of amazing finds that i susspect some people have been lucky to live when they did them,

1) Today I have tided up my airing cupboard around the central heating wires than run up the wall. God knows how the person who put the cable clips in to the wall was so lucky - they obliviously didn't work out that the immersion radial circuit runs up the same wall just below the surface of plaster in plastic conduit.

Amazingly on investigation both nails had MISSED the cable it's self - if they had hit the live etc they would of noticed! I have now labeled the wall as to where the cable runs and filled over the mess ups!!!! Quite pleased i don't have to replace anything.

2) BUT i need some advice on the following:

The plaster work/sinking of cables in their conduit is not the best ever in several places in my house. I put a shelf up recently in the kitchen and removed a nail that has been in the wall for years and years from previous owners. The plaster was quite loose and appeared to have been filled before so I chipped some away to investigate bearing in mind there is a double socket not far below that a monkey could even work out.

I find this:

As i said above it has a socket below just above the work top and as you can see it is part of a ring fed from in the first floor above.
The nail i removed (carefully) is the pin hole - the other thing you can see is a 5mm rawl plug that could well be in the cable!!!!!

Now obviously the rawl plug needs coming out and the cable investigating what is best practice the repair this cable if it looks damaged?

I would look at cutting out a section of conduit and crimping the effected wires back together, heatshrinking and plaster/fill over. Assuming that crimping is Ok in my CU there is quite a few!? I think ideally the whole length of wires down the wall need sinking in more. When kitchen extension is done i will do that.

Don't even get me started on what else I've found!
Many thanks in advance.

 

[Taylortwocities]

Its not unusual, I'm afraid. Like this:

And this one taken out from the wall in a kitchen, Each of the pointers shows a 'hit' on the cable (only a metre in length) from screw or nail....

Crimp and heat shrink is one method, repalcing the whole length back to the last socket is better.

Dont forget that electrical work in a kitchen is notifiable,,

 

[nozspark]

Dont forget that electrical work in a kitchen is notifiable,,

But repairs with 'like for like' are not!!

 

[kevsterdiy]

Its not unusual, I'm afraid. ..

Crimp and heat shrink is one method, repalcing the whole length back to the last socket is better.

Snap. Last socket it comes from is above and across a bit on landing the other way its under the bath and across to the next one in kitchen (i think) only had some floor up. So in other words a nightmare. Crimps it is,

Are these crimps standard - ie like the ones sued in automotive?

I was unaware that you could crimp 240v wires. as i mentioned above i found several in my CU, from where it has been replaced to a new style one. When i was fitting some MCB blanks they forgot you could see them, including the cooker that i was unsure of. What make me smile is the cooker N wire is extended with a crimp but with an earth wire, wrapped in blue tape! not ideal!

BTW my Mums fella is a sparky!

 

[kevsterdiy]

I may have another from the past on the same wires, slightly above i will check too. As far as i can see that should be it around the house unless they are well hidden, there is however doubt in the kitchen where two cupboard are joined and mounted on the wall.

How could i get a sparky to check this without removed said cupboards - is there a way?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I have now labeled the wall as to where the cable runs and filled over the mess ups!!!! Quite pleased i don't have to replace anything.

Ummm, well..

If the buried cable was not directly in line, horizontally or vertically, with an accessory, OR was not in a zone 150mm from the angle of two walls OR was not in a zone 150mm from the top of the wall then it wasn't in an acceptable place, and should be re-routed.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Last socket it comes from is above and across a bit on landing the other way its under the bath and across to the next one in kitchen (i think) only had some floor up.

That doesn't sound like it follows an acceptable route...

Are these crimps standard - ie like the ones sued in automotive?

Yes, but you must use a ratchet crimper to apply them, not the cheap old squeeze'n'hope ones sold for car use.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

there is however doubt in the kitchen where two cupboard are joined and mounted on the wall.

How could i get a sparky to check this without removed said cupboards - is there a way?

Unless you can find one with x-ray vision, all one could do is the same as you - remove sockets & lift floors and see where the cables run.

 

[kevsterdiy]

I have now labeled the wall as to where the cable runs and filled over the mess ups!!!! Quite pleased i don't have to replace anything.

Ummm, well..

If the buried cable was not directly in line, horizontally or vertically, with an accessory, OR was not in a zone 150mm from the angle of two walls OR was not in a zone 150mm from the top of the wall then it wasn't in an acceptable place, and should be re-routed.

It is WITHIN 150mm - just, from the corner of the wall and DOES run vertically (waves a bit which is good for builders i guess).
This comes down to common sense when drilling/nailing in a wall by a DIY'er more so than an error from new.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

It's often argued that the safety of the zone idea relies on people knowing about it in the first place...

 

[kevsterdiy]

Last socket it comes from is above and across a bit on landing the other way its under the bath and across to the next one in kitchen (i think) only had some floor up.

That doesn't sound like it follows an acceptable route...

Are these crimps standard - ie like the ones sued in automotive?

Yes, but you must use a ratchet crimper to apply them, not the cheap old squeeze'n'hope ones sold for car use.

I will get myself one of those then!!

It's my explanation if anything - it's hard to explain the house was built in 1974 and has one ring circuit all in floor level. About 75% of the sockets downstairs are rings, the rest spurs from upstairs (all singles in the day of course).

The Landing (one socket) is in the ring either before or after the kitchen this socket in question is the first one in the kitchen if you follow the ring (in the particular direction of course).

 

[kevsterdiy]

It's often argued that the safety of the zone idea relies on people knowing about it in the first place...

Exactly - got it in one. But of course combined with that you should use some good old common, which i think these people were missing when they did the heating at the same time. They had two 3map supplies to the heating controls: one FCU from a spur off the immersion AND one direct from the CU! Now made safe.

Another Muppet took power from the supply end of a 45amp cooker control switch to power the kitchen extractor via a surface mounted socket and PLUG above the extractor with 2.5sq cable, filling the hole they made with newspaper and hiding behind a cupboard! (the paper was dated 17/08/1991). Now made safe.

Plus the same muppet took a spur from a socket in the kitchen (on a ring) and went to a new socket mounted in a cupboard, THEN spurred of that one, ran behined a cooker just below worktop level, then behind the sink to a washing machine way over the others side of the room. Now made safe.

Another has taken power from a socket in the hall (originally a spur from upstairs) made it into a double socket then spured of it with 1.0sq cable to a FCU up the wall to an O/S light. Not ideal and due to be sorted.

In 30 years people can really muck things up hey!

 

[Click-Sure]

In 30 years people can really muck things up hey!

Yeah. You've seen NOTHING yet!

 

[consumer done over]

in the house we bought RCD test button and RCD button had been glued so they could not trip.

Previous owner ran a pond pump 24hrs 7 days week (also when on holiday) plugged into an indoor socket (no portable RCD in socker either).

 

[kevsterdiy]

I don't doubt there's worse out there.

Found yesterday as no surprise another rawl plug in the cable further up about 6 inches where plaster looked as if it had been filled!