Honda Izy HRG415C2 SDE starts then stops

[olneys]

Hello

My Honda mower worked fine last year, put away in the garage for the winter but now failed to start this week. A small amount of fuel left in the tank over winter.

I drained the old fuel out and replaced with new stuff and replaced the spark plug. On the first pull the engine starts for 3 sec and then stops, it will now not start if I continue to pull the cord but will start again for the same 3 sec period if left for a couple of minutes.

I have stripped down the carb, cleaned and re-assembled. I have checked that when the throttle lever is pushed into the choke position the carb paddle shuts off. Can also confirm that fuel flows from the tank to the carb bowl.

Any suggestions on what my next step should be would be very much appreciated, my grass is up to my knees!

Best regards

 

[olneys]

Hello again

Before my post drops off the first page, wanted to see if anyone could help with my mower.

thanks

olneys

 

[Burnerman]

When the engine is about to die, what happens if you put the choke back on.....does it attempt to keep going?
Presumably the paper air filter isn't contaminated with oil, due to the machine being tipped on its side?
When you stripped the carb, the float bowl comes off.....this allows you to release the float and needle valve.
Then, the main jet unscrews from the central drilling.
Now - above that there's an emulsion jet that comes out when the carb is tapped gently on the bench....did you find this? There are numerous drillings, cross through and lengthways, and these need to be spotless.
Presumably the idle mixture screw is tamperproof?
John

 

[olneys]

Hello John

Thanks for your reply.

Engine is started with the choke on, runs for 3 sec and then dies, so I don't get a chance to manually pull the choke off.

The emulsion jet has been removed and cleaned with compressed air, so I am happy that the carb is spotless.

I am able to set the idle mixture screw, it was originally set to 3 1/2 turns out. I have played with different depth settings on this with no joy.

Scratching my head with this one!

cheers

olneys

 

[Burnerman]

With the fuel tap open, remove the 10mm plug to the side of the float bowl (not the main jet one). Check that fuel flows freely, thus removing the sticky needle valve syndrome.
If thats ok, it has to be the main jet area really thats the problem.....if the fault is carb related!
Always use a new plug - NGK BPR6ES is the one. Izy's eat these.
Its a rare thing, but pop open the valve cover (4 screws) and check that both valves open and close freely.
Seen that the engine kill switch is opening when the handlebar lever is pulled...in fact disconnect it for a test.
John

 

[olneys]

Fuel flows freely, new plug has been inserted and the kill micro-switch is operating correctly. I will check the valves and report back.

cheers

 

[Mursal]

Take the air filter off and pour half an eggcup of fuel into the carburetor/manifold.

Replace air filter and try it for a start, OUTSIDE.

It just might need a bit of coaxing after the winter break ............

 

[olneys]

Hello Mursal

Thanks for your post.

I have already tried to start the engine by spraying 'Start Ya B*****d' into the air filter side of the carb with the same result...starts for 3 sec and then stops.

Burnerman - Valves appear to be working correctly, is there anything else that I can check\test or do you still think the issue to be the main jet?

Any further advice would be much appreciated.

best regards

 

[Burnerman]

Well, it does sound like a carb fault - but you also sound as if you know what you are doing!
If I'm cleaning a carb out, its a toluene based aerosol cleaner for me and compressed air - nothing else will do. Kitchen paper is a definite no-no.
These are basic enough carbs, with only one pilot jet (set at 1 1/4 turns out), one main jet and an emulsion tube....check that this isn't upside down!
Tricky parts of this machine are the gaskets and insulator block where the carb joins the cylinder head as you need 3 hands to keep them in place, as is reconnecting that breather hose onto the back of the air cleaner.
So - it would be as well to check that the ignition spark is continuing, but you'll need a flashing device that clips between the plug cap and plug to check that. I've only had one ignitor failure on these.
If the machine was fine when you put it away, its hard to think of anything else other than the carb in this circumstance!
John

 

[olneys]

BM

My knowledge and practical experience is rather limiting on small engines and hence the post.

With regard to the continuous ignition spark test, I have clamped the spark plug to the valve cover and pulled the cord continuously to observe a spark being produced, I'm guessing this has tested the ignition coil and spark plug function without the flashing device, am I correct?

I will strip the carb again and report back on how I get on. Thanks for your time on this one, much appreciated.

In the meantime I have bought a goat for the grass.

olneys

 

[Burnerman]

Usually thats the only test that the igniter needs.
So - its back to the carb then. If you have access to compressed air, then make sure the small drillings from the outside of the main venturi are clear. Although they are really pilot jet feeds, they do play a part.
if you don't have air, then an aerosol can of carb cleaner with a spout is needed to get anywhere, really.
It does sound like the fuel supply to the float chamber is restricted, but you say with the side bung out of the float bowl, lots of fuel flows (and continues to do so). You didn't get the float needle in upside down did you? Notice the needle has a groove that locates in the float, and when the float falls it actually pulls the needle down rather than relying on gravity.
Are you happy with the control rod and spring that connects to the carb butterfly....with the engine off, the throttle valve should be open.
John

 

[olneys]

BM

You've got me thinking now.

I have just taken a look at the workings of the carb in situ and this is what I've found.

When I push the lever knob at the side of the handle bars and move the throttle cable into the choke position the choke rod moves the choke valve and closes the paddle (happy with this), when I move the lever knob into the hare position the choke valve opens (which appears to be a fully open position). Now when I move the lever knob towards the tortoise position these relevant parts move, (governor arm, return spring, throttle arm and choke arm) but the (governor rod, throttle return spring and carb throttle valve do not). I do not understand what is going on between the hare and tortoise position with regard to what I am seeing on the side of the engine.

I would of thought the governor rod would be operating the carb throttle valve in some way.

Would you be able to shed some light?

olneys

 

[Mursal]

Click on the carburetor and control, might help?

http://bit.ly/12JGBnZ

But if you try it with a sup of petrol in the carb (outside in the garden) you will know if it can run, for longer than a few seconds?

 

[Burnerman]

BM

You've got me thinking now.

I have just taken a look at the workings of the carb in situ and this is what I've found.

When I push the lever knob at the side of the handle bars and move the throttle cable into the choke position the choke rod moves the choke valve and closes the paddle (happy with this), when I move the lever knob into the hare position the choke valve opens (which appears to be a fully open position). Now when I move the lever knob towards the tortoise position these relevant parts move, (governor arm, return spring, throttle arm and choke arm) but the (governor rod, throttle return spring and carb throttle valve do not). I do not understand what is going on between the hare and tortoise position with regard to what I am seeing on the side of the engine.

I would of thought the governor rod would be operating the carb throttle valve in some way.

Would you be able to shed some light?

olneys

That sounds about right, I think.....the throttle cable indirectly controls the spring pressure on the governor arm, rather than being connected directly to the carb.
Its only the choke rod thats directly connected.
The governor arm will be slightly off vertical (to the left). If you push it to the left it will spring back, but not fully to the right. There should be no mechanical resistance.
Engine off, the throttle valve should be open....feel free to wedge it that way if you think it will help with the start up!
As you see, moving the throttle lever does effectively nowt...its only when the engine is running (ha) that it comes into action!
John
P.S This thing had better co-operate soon....holiday tomorrow!

 

[olneys]

Mursal

I will give it a whirl and report back.

BM

If your still on-line, have a good hols, if you've reading this next week, hope you had a good hols.

olneys