New boiler time...

[nickjones]

After about 17 years my Ferolli combi boiler is showing signs of weakness:

Leaking underneath the boiler...regularly loses pressure.
worrying noises when running a bath.
I guess we could expect it to stop any time at this age (?) I'm no expert of course.

Aaaanyway.

BG came over tonight as a starting point and I have a quote that I'd like some guidance on with please from a non biased point of view.

I called 5 local people today...only one called me back so far! 2nd guy coming over tomorrow pm.

Anyone able to make a genuine recommendation to my area pls? I live a couple of miles from Kidderminster, Worcs. Thanks.

BG have put this to me: (Prices rounded)

Glowworm Flexicom 30cx £880.00
Fitting (same location-easy) £1200.00
Mini expansion vessel. £71.00
Wireless thermostat £145.00
Horizontal flue £215.00
Internal condensate conn. £75.00
Powerflush & water treat £435.00
Magnetic system filter £223.00
TRV's £60.00 ea. (Quoted me for 12, but will prob. need about 6)

So there you have it. Lots for you to get in to! I see from a FAQ here that glowworm was on the 'dubious' list?

Look forward to your comments/thoughts.

Nick

 

[ianniann]

Hehe, BG really like to stick it to you, don't they Boiler price is OK, fitting is OK, but then they add on loads more stuff. Did they add VAT on at the end? That's always my favourite. Price looks OK, then there's another 400 quid!

Check if you want a Glowworm. Check if you want a Magnaclean. Check if you want TRVs, they aren't mandatory on a straight boiler swap. Check which wireless controller you're getting since the cheaper ones are about 30 quid. Also decide if you even want a wireless controller since a like-for-like swap should already be wired. Read all the posts here, lots of opinions, but at least you'll know the things to think about.

Check what warranty you get, and whether there are valuable extras that BG sometimes throw in like a couple of years of boiler cover.

 

[mysteryman]

Same reply as above!

 

[nickjones]

Hehe, BG really like to stick it to you, don't they Boiler price is OK, fitting is OK, but then they add on loads more stuff. Did they add VAT on at the end? That's always my favourite. Price looks OK, then there's another 400 quid!

Check if you want a Glowworm. Check if you want a Magnaclean. Check if you want TRVs, they aren't mandatory on a straight boiler swap. Check which wireless controller you're getting since the cheaper ones are about 30 quid. Also decide if you even want a wireless controller since a like-for-like swap should already be wired. Read all the posts here, lots of opinions, but at least you'll know the things to think about.

Check what warranty you get, and whether there are valuable extras that BG sometimes throw in like a couple of years of boiler cover.

Yes, I can well see that he has put on every addition possible. He was quite open about it, and to be fair I liked his approach/knowledge etc.

Yep, VAT is included in all figures stated. Just been through it with a calculator. I was reading in the FAQ here about SS heat exchangers and how good they are. Vaillant have them (?) Does the Glowworm might you know? Is it really worth a thought?

I have good pressure and flow according to his attachment thingy.

I need a few TRV's and will selectively pick a few (I need about six).

Wireless is programmable, but no model offered. He made it sound quite 'smart'.

Homecare 200 is inc. for free for 1st yr.

Need to ask re warranty.

Many thanks, much appreciated. I do feel favourably towards the quote, and of course the name of BG gives (me anyway) confidence.

Cheers,

Nick

Oh, meant to ask, is a magnetic system filter worth the money @ £220.00?

 

[mickyg]

Bg are a joke. The coniving conmen sent out a flyer recently stating, "buy a new boiler before July 31st and receive a years "free" Homecare 100 worth £160! wow what a bargain, they're giving you a years warranty on a boiler!
As for that quote its a joke. by my calculation, even at prices I pay there's over £2000 worth of profit/labour there and thats not including the trvs which are the cheaper draytons, about £9 each, so thats £51 per trv.
Get some decent indendants in, get a better boiler for less money.

 

[namsag]

Can never understand how they get away with advertising free homecare as mickey says its the g`tee that should come as standard

 

[ianniann]

Yup, Homecare for the 1st year is worth diddly squat. Get them to add on a year after the end of the warranty and then it's worth something Any decent boiler will have a 2 year warranty and you can look for 5 years. Certification by most of the big quality boiler names brings an automatic 5 year manufacturer's warranty, subject to annual service.

Magnaclean gives you piece of mind. Or rather it gives BG piece of mind since any metal junk in your system is going to show up pretty quick or not at all. BTW, they don't cost that much I've never seen a manufacturer that requires these. They need a clean system, suitable water, and correct inhibitor. Then the warranty will cover your heat exchanger. Worcester cover it for 10 years, for example. Scale is usually excluded, but a Magnaclean won't help. I think Homecare just plain excludes heat exchangers, check the fine print.

Glow-Worms have aluminium heat exchangers. I don't think they're the end of the world, but people say the Glow-Worms aren't great in other ways. I don't know anything about them.

I recommend you put a lot of thought into what controller features you want. There's far more difference between controllers than between boilers (in functionality, if not in quality) and that's what you'll be using all the time. Anything from on/off and a thermostat, to systems that learn your behaviour and try to automatically turn the heating on to achieve the set temperature when you get up, etc. Many of them don't have on and off at all, just different set temperatures at different times. Then there are modulating controllers (turn the radiator temperature down to maintain room temperature rather than the thermostat constantly switching the heating on and off) although the ones worth having need a boiler that supports that feature.

 

[mickyg]

if you get bg to do the job you'll definately need the heating filter as they won't flush it properly. Not the fitters fault, its the stupid company who give em 3 hours to do it. You would think paying that sort of money the guys would be given whatever time they needed to make sure the job is top notch.

 

[simond]

Glow-Worms have aluminium heat exchangers. I don't think they're the end of the world, but people say the Glow-Worms aren't great in other ways. I don't know anything about them.

Two points;

- I thought Glowworms you can buy today have a stainless steel heat exchanger
- You were right in your last comment

 

[45yearsagasman]

Can never understand how they get away with advertising free homecare as mickey says its the g`tee that should come as standard

As I understand it the boiler comes with the manufacturers warranty and the free homecare is to cover for any faults that may appear in the rest of the system,even if if it was only a boiler change.

 

[echoes]

For a simple replacement/flush/clean, I've been charged £2k inc VAT in Sheffield for a Baxi, and my mother-in-law was charged a similar amount in Surrey. All 'extras' like 'pipes', 'flue', 'thermostat' included!

 

[Agile]

Its only to be expected that a large company will charge higher prices as they have to properly pay their staff and provide liveried vans and their uniforms and still make a good profit to maintain their Head Office, call centres and then pay a dividend to their shareholders.

A smaller independent has none of those overheads, can come in the same estate car he uses to go to ASDA, and only has to cover his own labour charges.

So its not surprising that I copuld usually do a £3000 BG job for £1500. But I would prefer to use a better boiler and charge about £1700.

Some BG installations are done without properly treating the system. Someone recently bought some bottles of inhibitor on Ebay. They all had the stickers missing so many boilers have a sticker but no actual inhibitor in the system. Its not known whose installations those were though.

Tony

 

[namsag]

45 yeargasman take your point.
But i have seem it on quotes for complete systems too. which is what i was getting at.

Agile the inhibitor is probably from jobs that bungs have been used on when changing components under g`tee

 

[mickyg]

Can never understand how they get away with advertising free homecare as mickey says its the g`tee that should come as standard

As I understand it the boiler comes with the manufacturers warranty and the free homecare is to cover for any faults that may appear in the rest of the system,even if if it was only a boiler change.

yeh but the homecare 100 is only boiler and controls cover. if your having a combi and a new timer, well thats about it! Appreciate that on a ov boiler and system it would stretch to the pump, MVs, programmer and stat. Which i very much doubt is a £161 annual insurance cost.
In any case, 1 year at those prices is dismal. I and many other people fit boilers with 5 year guarantees. The Glowworms that BG install should come with a 2yr guarantee, except BG only get 1 yr cos they pay such a low price for the boiler! So your being done out of a years guarantee by using BG! Incidentally I offer 5yr P&L on Glowworms as well.

 

[Alfredo]

Maybe we all charge too little

Did a Viessmann 100 direct swap, no flush, but cleansed system for a week beforehand, inc magnaclean & 12 TRVs, inhibitor, £2,200 all in. This included the flue and installing an internal condensate drain of course. 5 years warranty on the boiler, parts and labour.

There is nothing wrong with the Glow Worm incidentally. I worked on them for yonks. Install them ok and they are fine.

I've no problems with the job BG will do for you, but a good local independent will do just as good if not better job for 1/3 or so less.

Alfredo