No Voltage on Wires in Light Switch

[Jetheat]

are you telling us that the three core and earth cable that has no voltage is not connected at the new smart switch ?

I have one Smart Switch connected and one old switch connected on the 2-way system.
The smart switch works and the old switch doesn't work.

There is voltage at the smart switch and no voltage at the outlet where the old switch is connected.

I have just tested the terminals on the Continuity setting and it does show a reading of 097 on the Live and Switched Live for one of the gangs (on the outlet with the old switch). The other gang shows no reading.

What does all this mean?

I'm sorry I'm not really familiar with the jargon or technical stuff so I'm still trying to decode what these posts mean.

JH

 

[Jetheat]

are you telling us that the three core and earth cable that has no voltage is not connected at the new smart switch ?

I have one Smart Switch connected and one old switch connected on the 2-way system.
The smart switch works and the old switch doesn't work.

There is voltage at the smart switch and no voltage at the outlet where the old switch is connected.

I have just tested the terminals on the Continuity setting and it does show a reading of 097 on the Live and Switched Live for one of the gangs (on the outlet with the old switch). The other gang shows no reading.

What does all this mean?

I'm sorry I'm not really familiar with the jargon or technical stuff so I'm still trying to decode what these posts mean.

JH

 

[ETAF]

this may be dangerous doing continuity tests on unknown wiring, may still be live.

As requested i asked for BETTER photos - showing the cable coming into the back box and onto the switch. need to see what cable Set is connected to What Gang
and perhaps a fuller explanation - in stages

STARTING with
What you have again

you have 2 switch BOX , 1 in different parts of house , each switch box has 2 gangs 2 switches on each - , both switches control different pair of lights - which can be turned on/off with the 2 different switchs and a different light is controlled by the other pair of lights

Did you look at the wiring diagram i linked to - and does that look like the setup on 1 gang on the two switch box

 

[bernardgreen]

I have one Smart Switch connected and one old switch connected on the 2-way system.

I don't think you will have any success if you are mixing a smart switch and a conventional ( old ) switch on a two way system.

"Smart" switches in a two way system often have two types of switch. One type [A] does the actual switching of power to the lamp. The other type is a remote controller which send instructions to the type [A] and does not switch power other than a control signal to the type [A]

I used [A] and B instead of the more common terminology of Master and Slave,

Using the terms Master and Slave can be misleading as often the Master switches power to the lamp and the Slave sends command to the Master.

 

[Jetheat]

Ok, I have taken 3 more photos of the non-working outlet.
I have connected a different switch here (which was from the other side of the 2-way because that switch is definitely working).

On the NoSleeves image, you can see that the sleeves are not visible because they are behind the back box. I have rewired several times using one live with the other switched live just to make sure I was using wires from the same sleeve behind the wall. But still no voltage reading.

You can also see the earth cable securely connected to the corner of the back box.

The topview and bottomview images show how I have connected the wires to the terminals.
The continuity reading showed that there was continuity at the top terminals but not the bottom terminals.


The other outlet was working well and is still working well, even after I have connected the new Lightwave switch on there.
There are 10 wires in that outlet plus the Earth.

2 of the wires tested positive for voltage.

The new switch only requires me to connect one Live and one Switched Live. It will do the rest through the app.
So I have connected one of the Live wires and one of the Switched Live wires to this new Lightwave switch and then I have put the rest in connector blocks.
So, so far, one side of the switch works as expected while the other side side of the same switch has to be set up through the app.

JH

 

[Jetheat]

I don't think you will have any success if you are mixing a smart switch and a conventional ( old ) switch on a two way system.

"Smart" switches in a two way system often have two types of switch. One type [A] does the actual switching of power to the lamp. The other type is a remote controller which send instructions to the type [A] and does not switch power other than a control signal to the type [A]

I used [A] and B instead of the more common terminology of Master and Slave,

Using the terms Master and Slave can be misleading as often the Master switches power to the lamp and the Slave sends command to the Master.

I did connect the new Lightwave Smart Switch to the non-working outlet initially but since that didn't light up, I tested the wires and found no voltage. So I took it off and reconnected an older switch to see if that would make a difference.
JH

 

[ETAF]

The other outlet was working well and is still working well, even after I have connected the new Lightwave switch on there.
There are 10 wires in that outlet plus the Earth.

Again photos of that switch

So its important to work out the 3 wires & Earth which main cable they go to behind the box if at all possible - you can not mix them up
Brown/Black/Grey/Earth - needs to be the same set - so will all be covered in another outer insulation.
Are you at least able to workout which SET is which ?

OR are you 100% that the 3 wires say into the bottom are from the same main cable ? OR the TOP 3 are the same cable

 

[bernardgreen]

I don't know if this is the Lightwave switches you have but it is a generic for most "smart" two way switching systems

Note the IMPORTANT comment

 

[Alec_t]

2-way lighting requires 3 wires running between the two switches. If your smart switch is a 2-wire only device, I don't see how that will work 2-way lighting ?

 

[Jetheat]

2-way lighting requires 3 wires running between the two switches. If your smart switch is a 2-wire only device, I don't see how that will work 2-way lighting ?

The guy at Lightwave told me to connect just two wires and the rest is taken care off via the app.
One Live and one Switched Live.
Cap the rest.

I have already connected my 2-way passage one in the same way.

JH

 

[Jetheat]

So is there anything I can do about the dead wires?

 

[ETAF]

see post #37

 

[Jetheat]

Again photos of that switch

So its important to work out the 3 wires & Earth which main cable they go to behind the box if at all possible - you can not mix them up
Brown/Black/Grey/Earth - needs to be the same set - so will all be covered in another outer insulation.
Are you at least able to workout which SET is which ?

OR are you 100% that the 3 wires say into the bottom are from the same main cable ? OR the TOP 3 are the same cable

I have uploaded 2 pics.

The NonWorkingK2 image is a picture of the switch which is not working and has the wire sleeves behind the backbox. I can't pull the wire sleeves out but peering very closely, I see that the top 3 wires are coming from the same sleeve. So I assume the other 3 wires are coming from another sleeve.
I had wired the same top 3 wires into the same module/gang on the switch.
It was the other 3 wires that were showing some continuity and not the top 3 wires.

Now have a look at the other switch (WorkingK1 image).
I have separated all the wires.
There are 4 sets of wires (from 4 outer insulations).
I have separated them according to which sleeve they come from.
The set which I have used to connect to the switch only has 2 wires from that sleeve.
Using my Multimeter, I found that there are 2 live wires in total which I have indicated.
All the other wires don't show any voltage except the Switched Live one which I have connected (while the switch is turned on).

I hope this gives some clarity on the setup.

JH

 

[ETAF]

ok, so now you have confirmed the wire groups, you should be able to look at the wiring/circuit diagrams to see how all those wires are connected and which should be live
Check you understand that linked circuit diagram - if not post back questions BEFORE you do anything else

BUT now you have them all disconnected - with the power off
you should be able to TEST the 3 core cable - as that SHOULD just be one bit of cable between each switch
now you have a multimeter - you can set on continuity ohms and test to see if a cable is broken

The only wire that should be LIVE is the 2core & earth cable - One side will be LIVE all the time, which maybe the brown and the switched Live will be the BLUE with a brown sleeve - BUT it maybe the otherway round

SO ONLY have LIVE with them all disconnected on the 2cores - either BROWN or BLUE/brown Sleeve
so you could test that for 240V with the AC Setting and between Earth and cable core

NEXT as i say with the power off - so its all dead

DO YOU have a length of cable that goes between the switches if NOT

ON THE 3 core cable - you could at one switch - connect a multimeter on OHMS continuity - low reading
test the meter by touching its probes together - and should get a zero reading

NOW you could put the probes onto the BLACK & GREY then at the other switch touch the black and GREY together - you should get zero reading , if so - you know those 2 cables are OK
Then repeat the same setup for the BLACK and BROWN - again then if zero you know those 2 cables are OK
IF No reading they one of the wires is faulty

you could make use of the earth to test

THIS IS QUITE DANGEROUS IF POWER ON , and NOT wired as expected from the Circuit diagram link i posted earlier

 

[Jetheat]

Thanks for the write-up. I'm working my way through it.
My first question is, do I have 2-core system or 3-core system?
On my Working switch, I have two sets which have 3 wires coming out and the other two sets which have two wires coming out.
On the other side, each sleeve has 3 wires coming out.

Do I have a 2-core or 3-core system?

JH