You think i should im waiting for a call back so i am telling myself that i will say "listen i was trying to help after the accident but got told i wasnt needed so its too late now im not intrested in helping now,goodbye"
Old pipework failed, whos fault ?
- Thread starter malkie
- Start date
Sponsored Links
D
Deleted member 105431
they were unreasonable first, i can't see them being reasonable now.
Have you considered that they caused the leak and therefore the damage just to try and get their property 'upgraded' at your expense?
Probably not the case but I never trust anyone.
As for the future, I would recommend joining the Federation of Small Businesess, you get quite a bit of good insurance cover, legal advice and a service to cover a tax/VAT inspection that pays it all for you, all for £100 + VAT a year as a sole trader
Probably not the case but I never trust anyone.
As for the future, I would recommend joining the Federation of Small Businesess, you get quite a bit of good insurance cover, legal advice and a service to cover a tax/VAT inspection that pays it all for you, all for £100 + VAT a year as a sole trader
D
Deleted member 105431
Sponsored Links
Please Note. I will guarantee my own work and pipe installation. I cannot though guarantee any existing part of your system. Although rare, on occasion when converting to a pressurized system from an open-vent (gravity) installation, pipe work is sometimes not up to the increased pressures and can leak. Although I can repair these it will be at additional cost to you and any damage incurred to furnishings due to such a leak will not be my responsibility.
Thats a copy of what appears on all my quotes. I hope this works out in your favour!
Daaman
Thats a copy of what appears on all my quotes. I hope this works out in your favour!
Daaman
We have a similar text in our quotes.
If there are latent defects in the original installation and they are boxed in or hidden under the floor it is not reasonable to expect an installer to have prior knowledge.
I guess a good analogy would be you get a mechanic to replace a knackered engine in a car, and the transmission fails soon after.
The new engine had a better torque performance than the old worn out one, but that does not make the mechanic responsible for the transmission. That defect was already there, the new engine just brought it to light earlier.
If there are latent defects in the original installation and they are boxed in or hidden under the floor it is not reasonable to expect an installer to have prior knowledge.
I guess a good analogy would be you get a mechanic to replace a knackered engine in a car, and the transmission fails soon after.
The new engine had a better torque performance than the old worn out one, but that does not make the mechanic responsible for the transmission. That defect was already there, the new engine just brought it to light earlier.
you have to be given the option to get any damage repaired , if it was your fault.you can only guarantee any work you do and advise customer of any problems that may occur in the event of not renewing existing components. always stick by the fact that you used duty of care and informed the customer .
Seen this twice in the last two months, firstly at a house i had just changed the boiler at. I was visiting after a week to make sure all was ok.. i was demonstrating the boiler/ central heating and an original joint in the loft let go as I was explaining to the customer which was my pipework and which was the old.
When i pulled the joint apart the pipe was only 2mm into the fitting. bloke couldnt have been better about it and said it wasnt my fault it wasnt my pipework.
Second time was to repair a leak on a hot water feed to the kitchen tap. BG had just installed a new boiler to an existing system the day before and the joint behind the kichen units had given way. I had to pull out all the kitchen to get at pipework..
Householder never considered calling BG who coincidently had only charged her 7800 for a boiler swap..
Just rewording my quote/ estimate disclaimers.. where is BG's..
When i pulled the joint apart the pipe was only 2mm into the fitting. bloke couldnt have been better about it and said it wasnt my fault it wasnt my pipework.
Second time was to repair a leak on a hot water feed to the kitchen tap. BG had just installed a new boiler to an existing system the day before and the joint behind the kichen units had given way. I had to pull out all the kitchen to get at pipework..
Householder never considered calling BG who coincidently had only charged her 7800 for a boiler swap..
Just rewording my quote/ estimate disclaimers.. where is BG's..
D
Deleted member 105431
I have great sympathy with you on this one. My gut feeling is that 3.5k of damage is a non starter.....think. If the old pipe work went upstairs only the water in the rads/pipework would have been released. Say 4 rads and associate pipiework?? Hardly a mega flood. If we accept that there is some damage i can't see all ceilings needing to be replaced.......just touched up/painted.
The problem with these cases is that the courts are very sympathetic to 'joe public'. My experience is that the onus will be on you to show you did everything to mitigate the potential for this to happen. you have a good peice of ammo in the disclaimer you wrote......but note this a disclaimer doesn't absolve you of taking reasonable care in doing your job. Only a judge will decide on reasonable bearing in mind your the professional......that said, i think your being stitched up here. Write to the customer and ask for a breakdown of the costs that they are asking for. This will allow you to see what they are claiming for......then write again detailing why you belive your not liable, state that you highlighted the potential issues and that you would be happy to pass then onto tradesmen that will do good repairs at reasonabl costs.....try to sound sincere and concerned but state firmly you deny any liability and that if the customer initiates court action you will defend it. This will help show any judge you didn't ignore the matter. Keep us all posted
The problem with these cases is that the courts are very sympathetic to 'joe public'. My experience is that the onus will be on you to show you did everything to mitigate the potential for this to happen. you have a good peice of ammo in the disclaimer you wrote......but note this a disclaimer doesn't absolve you of taking reasonable care in doing your job. Only a judge will decide on reasonable bearing in mind your the professional......that said, i think your being stitched up here. Write to the customer and ask for a breakdown of the costs that they are asking for. This will allow you to see what they are claiming for......then write again detailing why you belive your not liable, state that you highlighted the potential issues and that you would be happy to pass then onto tradesmen that will do good repairs at reasonabl costs.....try to sound sincere and concerned but state firmly you deny any liability and that if the customer initiates court action you will defend it. This will help show any judge you didn't ignore the matter. Keep us all posted
I think that the legal argument will hinge around this question that the customer said all the pipework was quite new ( and therefore not expected to leak ).
The Courts are inclined towards the attitude that the public are not experts and cannot be expected to really know the condition of their pipework.
The plumber is expected to be an expert and so would be expected to examine the pipework in the property before commencing any makor work.
Of course we have all been told by customers that things have been replaced which have not. Thats part of our problem.
Tony
The Courts are inclined towards the attitude that the public are not experts and cannot be expected to really know the condition of their pipework.
The plumber is expected to be an expert and so would be expected to examine the pipework in the property before commencing any makor work.
Of course we have all been told by customers that things have been replaced which have not. Thats part of our problem.
Tony
Thanks lads,I am gutted because this all came from me trying to do 2 things
(1) save a bit of time
(2) save disturbing their bathroom tiles and keeping the pipework looking neat to the combi.
I should have done what I intended to do but we all make decisions like this and thank god we dont even think about them again. I said to myself when I went out on my own working for myself "I will be as helpful and decent as I can be" as im now 30 and look young for my age so I try and use everything I can to get me more work.
Im now thinking is it worth it?.
I know if it goes to court I will lose because they will say "he's the one who is supposed to be the expert,not us"
(1) save a bit of time
(2) save disturbing their bathroom tiles and keeping the pipework looking neat to the combi.
I should have done what I intended to do but we all make decisions like this and thank god we dont even think about them again. I said to myself when I went out on my own working for myself "I will be as helpful and decent as I can be" as im now 30 and look young for my age so I try and use everything I can to get me more work.
Im now thinking is it worth it?.
I know if it goes to court I will lose because they will say "he's the one who is supposed to be the expert,not us"
I would keep a log of all calls between you and the customer and what was said.
Also i dont like the fact you said their sons called you demanding the fee for your work returning plus another £2,500. This could be construed as threatening behaviour.
The next time they call tell them you are recording all calls between yourselves and that you are seeking legal advice,also tell them you are off work with stress caused by them.
Point out the fact that they told you all pipework was replaced 7 years ago and had not been ,so they should seek recompense from the last installer who did not do the job he was paid to do.
Either way ,turn it round on them leave them in no doubt you will not be pushed round.
Also i dont like the fact you said their sons called you demanding the fee for your work returning plus another £2,500. This could be construed as threatening behaviour.
The next time they call tell them you are recording all calls between yourselves and that you are seeking legal advice,also tell them you are off work with stress caused by them.
Point out the fact that they told you all pipework was replaced 7 years ago and had not been ,so they should seek recompense from the last installer who did not do the job he was paid to do.
Either way ,turn it round on them leave them in no doubt you will not be pushed round.
DIYnot Local
Staff member
If you need to find a tradesperson to get your job done, please try our local search below, or if you are doing it yourself you can find suppliers local to you.
Select the supplier or trade you require, enter your location to begin your search.
Are you a trade or supplier? You can create your listing free at DIYnot Local
Sponsored Links
