Outdoor socket advice

[morg]

Hi, I posted a thread a few weeks ago, but I can't find it.

Need to fit a socket outdoors.

My question is, If I fit an outdoor junction box directly over the outside hole (from an indoor socket), how will I stop the water seeping in from behind? Or is it just $ods law?

I need a junction box, because there will be two sockets running off this.

Thanks for any help

 

[morg]

Keep in mind that the box pictured will be fitted upside down (the 1-hole entry INSIDE the box from existing socket, then two holes at bottom for the 2 sockets)

 

[ColJack]

now hang on, it's gone from "a socket" to 2 sockets..
how are they wired and from what?
does whatever you're wiring it from have an RCD?
what cable are you going to use?
where are the sockets going?
who's doing it?
have you heard of Part P?
sockets outdoors are notifiable to the council who will want to inspect them before you turn them on and will charge you a couple of hundred quid for the privalige..

 

[Chri5]

Before mounting the box, gun some sealant around the perimeter rear of box and do the same with the cable entry hole.

You can also frame the mounted box with sealant.

 

[morg]

Thank you Chri5, I was going to suggest silicone, but didnt know whether it was suitable, will do that then

Cheers for the advice pal

ColJack, it will be wired from a suitable socket, yes my box has an RCD.
From previous socket to junction box will be t&e 2.5mm, then 1.5mm 3 core Hituf Cable will be used from the junction box to the two sockets.

From junction box, the first socket will be going into garage (1 metre away), the other socket will be about 5-6 metres away to power my pond equipment.

I know what I'm doing, I wouldn't attempt to fit showers etc, this is as far as I'm capable of, its a fairly straight forward diy job for me.

I have fitted a socket there before, but recently removed it to upgrade (ie new pond build)

Cheers

 

[ricicle]

How do you propose testing afterwards ?

 

[Cremeegg]

Rhetorical question of course Rice.

Of course he doesnt even think about testing. Or Part P. As long as it works when he switches it on it must be OK.

Trouble with these sites - on the one hand at least people are asking for help and might take notice of advice given on the other hand it purely encourages more DIY bodges.

 

[morg]

Rhetorical question of course Rice.

Of course he doesnt even think about testing. Or Part P. As long as it works when he switches it on it must be OK.

Trouble with these sites - on the one hand at least people are asking for help and might take notice of advice given on the other hand it purely encourages more DIY bodges.

So what would be the difference between a qualified person and a keen diy'er to fit an outdoor socket here be?

Ok a botch job by a diy'er might include

Adding an outdoor socket to a unsuitable existing socket

Loose connection when adding the extra cable to the existing socket or insulator rammed into the terminal connectors,

cable overstripped/understripped, bending the cable and maneuvering it in awkward ways which might weaken it

Inappropriate parts used or not used (cable size, enclosure boxes, sockets, cable glands etc)

Choc blocks wrapped in insulation tape

Burying normal cable in the lawn

Fitting the socket next to the outside tap

 

[holmslaw]

..

 

[electronicsuk]

All this part P stuff aside, are you spurring directly from an existing indoor socket? If so, you can only have one outdoor socket, not two, and it must be fed in 2.5mmsq. If you want two sockets, you need an FCU with 13A fuse inside, and this will also allow you to use your 1.5mmsq HiTuf for the outdoor sections, volt drop and loop impedance permitting.

Oh, and if you were thinking of burying the HiTuf to the pond, forget it. It isn't suitable for direct burial without being enclosed in a metal conduit or duct.

 

[morg]

Morg, don't make a hole in the back of the box. Mount the box a couple of inches above the hole in the wall and bring all 3 cables into the bottom 2 cable entries.

Thanks holmslaw, ok I will follow that advice, thanks.

But that means I won't be able to use T&E to connect existing socket to junction box? Because the T&E will be exposed. Should I use the HiTuf cable instead of the T&E then?

Cheers

 

[holmslaw]

..

 

[morg]

All this part P stuff aside, are you spurring directly from an existing indoor socket? If so, you can only have one outdoor socket, not two, and it must be fed in 2.5mmsq. If you want two sockets, you need an FCU with 13A fuse inside, and this will also allow you to use your 1.5mmsq HiTuf for the outdoor sections, volt drop and loop impedance permitting.

Oh, and if you were thinking of burying the HiTuf to the pond, forget it. It isn't suitable for direct burial without being enclosed in a metal conduit or duct.

Hi thanks for the advice mate.
Yes, directly from existing socket.

I will also take your advice then, so I'll get a FCU, what cable should I run from the existing socket to a FCU then? I might even think about putting the FCU in the garage, and running another cable out from garage to pond equipment.

No I wasn't planning on burying this stuff, it's going to run about 100mm above ground, is this ok? Or should I use conduit anyways?

Thanks for the help

 

[electronicsuk]

Hi thanks for the advice mate.
Yes, directly from existing socket.

I will also take your advice then, so I'll get a FCU, what cable should I run from the existing socket to a FCU then?

You can use 2.5mmsq T+E for your short spur from the nearby indoor socket to the FCU supply terminals, also indoors. From the FCU load side terminals you can use your 1.5mmsq HiTuf.

I might even think about putting the FCU in the garage, and running another cable out from garage to pond equipment.

I'm not sure that would work. The FCU is there as you're only allowed one unfused spur from any point on a ring final circuit, be it a double socket, FCU, single socket, or any other electrical accessory. If you spur from the indoor socket to the outdoor, and also to an FCU in the garage feeding another outdoor socket, that's more than one accessory being fed by an unfused spur.

Why not go indoor socket > 2.5mm T+E > FCU supply > FCU load > 1.5mm HiTuf > garage socket > 1.5mm HiTuf > Pond socket, thus alleviating the need for a JB?

No I wasn't planning on burying this stuff, it's going to run about 100mm above ground, is this ok? Or should I use conduit anyways?

Nah, that should be fine, it'll take a fair bit of hammer to damage HiTuf. It's fun enough to strip with a sharp knife, never mind garden tools.

 

[Cremeegg]

Well more "advice" yet still no mention of how this DIYer is going to test his work to ensure it, or any part of the installation that he is connecting to, gets anywhere near complying with BS7671 and similarly no mention of any intention of notifying this work to Building Control under Part P.

A competent registered sparks will do both.

Cowboys do neither.