Petrol and diesel car sales ban brought forward to 2035

This isn't something switching to electric cars can solve, they aren't that much greener than fossil fueled modern cars over their lifecycle.
Yeah they are. If you're interested I'll dig out references but in short they're somewhere between as good as the cleanest hybrids or much better at the moment. The reason I bolded that is that as we put more renewables onto the grid they're only going to get better in terms of carbon footprint.

They cost a fortune not to just purchase but to also repair. (A replacement battery can be a 5k bill easy) this will leave many in transportation poverty, leaving them unable to get to work.
They aren't cheap, yet. They will be. They're simpler than ICE vehicles and once they actually get up to mass market numbers the price will fall. Right now only one EV has more than 100k production a year, the Tesla Model 3. If you build tiny numbers of cars then each one is extortionate.

In terms of maintenance they're cheaper than normal cars. The battery is expensive but they're holding up well in real life and even once they're old and worn out they still hold a lot of value for other uses. Plus as the price of batteries is plummeting the cost to replace them is also falling.

A $5,000 battery now would get you roughly 25-40kWh ($125-200 per kWh). In 2012 that would have bought you about 10kWh ($500-600 per kWh). The prices will continue to fall over time.

There's a lot of crap floating about from die hard petrol heads about EVs.
 
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Yeah they are. If you're interested I'll dig out references but in short they're somewhere between as good as the cleanest hybrids or much better at the moment. The reason I bolded that is that as we put more renewables onto the grid they're only going to get better in terms of carbon footprint.


They aren't cheap, yet. They will be. They're simpler than ICE vehicles and once they actually get up to mass market numbers the price will fall. Right now only one EV has more than 100k production a year, the Tesla Model 3. If you build tiny numbers of cars then each one is extortionate.

In terms of maintenance they're cheaper than normal cars. The battery is expensive but they're holding up well in real life and even once they're old and worn out they still hold a lot of value for other uses. Plus as the price of batteries is plummeting the cost to replace them is also falling.

A $5,000 battery now would get you roughly 25-40kWh ($125-200 per kWh). In 2012 that would have bought you about 10kWh ($500-600 per kWh). The prices will continue to fall over time.

There's a lot of crap floating about from die hard petrol heads about EVs.

I think the concern is whether costs will come down enough for a non rich person to afford access to the technology and the fuel.

My fear is that the UK government has outsourced Hinckley C with the result the energy price will be high.
If that is the model used to increase capacity for EV the UK will be vulnerable to foreign interests.
 
I think the concern is whether costs will come down enough for a non rich person to afford access to the technology and the fuel.

My fear is that the UK government has outsourced Hinckley C with the result the energy price will be high.
If that is the model used to increase capacity for EV the UK will be vulnerable to foreign interests.
I don't think there's any appetite to replicate Hinckley C again. Hopefully the power will mostly come from wind and solar which are now almost zero subsidy.

The BIK changes in April will mean a flood of EVs for business, which will hit the second hand market in 2-3 years. Most people buy cars second hand after all.
 
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Maybe the future is FCEV ?
It's possible but they're far more expensive than EVs right now.

They used to have a theoretical advantage for long range driving (faster fill ups) but with the stupidly fast charges you can get on the better new EVs (250-350kW!) even that advantage is disappearing.
 
It's possible but they're far more expensive than EVs right now.

They used to have a theoretical advantage for long range driving (faster fill ups) but with the stupidly fast charges you can get on the better new EVs (250-350kW!) even that advantage is disappearing.

They're more expensive than BEV's as they're made in very small numbers.

Still fill an FCEV in a comparable time to a petrol car.

They still have a longer range.

They don't suffer so much in cold climates.

They don't use anything like as much commodity metals.

Disadvantages

There's almost no infrastructure. (but that's true to a lesser extent to BEV's

They cost far too much currently

Hydrogen fuelling needs added precautions.

Apart from those surmountable problems, they sound on paper a better proposition to me.

(Oh, and Paedo name checking bloke doesn't like them, but who cares what the druggie says)
 
It's not impossible, but it seems unlikely.

For HEVs to become mainstream they need cheap hydrogen, cheap HEVs and a widespread infrastructure. None of those exist yet and you're not going to get any single part without all the others.

At least with BEVs you can (and did)kick start the process with home charging. It's now getting to the point where it's in a virtuous cycle but for HEVs to catch up and overtake BEVs? I can't see it, even if it is in theory possible.
 
It's not impossible, but it seems unlikely.

For HEVs to become mainstream they need cheap hydrogen, cheap HEVs and a widespread infrastructure. None of those exist yet and you're not going to get any single part without all the others.

At least with BEVs you can (and did)kick start the process with home charging. It's now getting to the point where it's in a virtuous cycle but for HEVs to catch up and overtake BEVs? I can't see it, even if it is in theory possible.

Most of those don't really exist with BEV's (Still I guess it'll just be a VHS vs Betamax scenario again)
 
Most of those don't really exist with BEV's (Still I guess it'll just be a VHS vs Betamax scenario again)
Widespread infrastructure does exist. If you can charge at home and you use the motorways for your long drives you're fine in the UK. It could be better but it's good enough now.

Cheap hydrogen? Well, no, but electricity is cheap and to charge your EV it's a fraction of the cost of petrol or diesel, let alone hydrogen.

Cheap EVs? Yeah, nope. But on the other hand they are cheap enough that they're cheaper to own in the medium to long term and the prices are dropping. If they were any cheaper then you'd see year long waiting lists for them (which you do for some).
 
Widespread infrastructure does exist. If you can charge at home....
I was talking to a mate the other day who said he'd be interested in a fully electric car but as he pointed out, he lives in a terraced house in London. Where’s his infrastructure? Even if they changed it so that you had a charging point on the kerb near your house, what happens when he comes home from work and can’t park anywhere near his house? Now multiply that by the millions of motorists like him or who live in high rise blocks.......
 
C0F351E2-A3BD-41EC-A670-4305A6E5DE18.jpeg
 
I was talking to a mate the other day who said he'd be interested in a fully electric car but as he pointed out, he lives in a terraced house in London. Where’s his infrastructure? Even if they changed it so that you had a charging point on the kerb near your house, what happens when he comes home from work and can’t park anywhere near his house? Now multiply that by the millions of motorists like him or who live in high rise blocks.......
https://cleantechnica.com/2020/02/0...rol-station-to-ev-charging-station-in-uk/amp/

Shell announced in October that it wouldn’t just be adding EV charging stations to more gas/petrol stations, but that it would actually be fully converting a gas/petrol station to an EV charging station.
Or perhaps at IKEA, or Tesco, or his work. Some people do actually own and run EVs without the ability to charge at home. It seems like more trouble than it's worth to me but there are those that do it and are happy doing it.

Or perhaps we don't need to have the solution in place for every single one of the 32 million cars in the UK today to accept there is enough infrastructure for some, or even most of them.
 
Or perhaps we don't need to have the solution in place for every single one of the 32 million cars in the UK today to accept there is enough infrastructure for some, or even most of them.

Quite, EV's will certainly solve the problem of 'congestion'.

PAY-NNP-EMPTY_STREETS_NEWCASTLE_3.jpg
 
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