Re wiring all TV/ satellite system. What I need to do? Help
Sponsored Links
fwiw in my house there are several places where cat5/6, coax, phone, hdmi and mains all come down the inside of the same gap in the studwork.
Reread post #13 - the end - it's edited to address your questions from your later post #14.
Go back and have another read of that post and the rest of the thread. It's all answered either there or in the previous posts in this thread.
- Joined
- 27 Jan 2008
- Messages
- 23,655
- Reaction score
- 2,663
- Location
- Llanfair Caereinion, Nr Welshpool
- Country
Putting the power cable in a Faraday cage will help, however the problem is any metallic covering if not earthed can transmit a fault between rooms, you can wire in SWA, braid or Ali-tube, and all will reduce the radio waves leaving the cable, however I still think in the main we can get away without such lengths being used.
I remember as an apprentice being given a radio to fit, I tried all the things I had been taught, chokes, capacitors, braid between bonnet and chassis, and still interference, an old mechanic said try another radio, I have got one here, see if that radio has interference, and on trying it did not have any interference coming through, it was the radio at fault not the way I had fitted it, and this I have seen repeated many times, so radio receivers will pick up any signal even if not on the frequency it is designed to receive on.
Does not even need to be a radio, I remember the Police car radio coming through my dads electronic organ, there is simply no point screening if the equipment is not designed to reject out of band transmissions.
So if your a radio ham and want to use QRP (word they use for very low power) and talk across the pond with 2 watt then maybe Ali-tube mains cables are worth while, but for most people it is not required.
I remember as an apprentice being given a radio to fit, I tried all the things I had been taught, chokes, capacitors, braid between bonnet and chassis, and still interference, an old mechanic said try another radio, I have got one here, see if that radio has interference, and on trying it did not have any interference coming through, it was the radio at fault not the way I had fitted it, and this I have seen repeated many times, so radio receivers will pick up any signal even if not on the frequency it is designed to receive on.
Does not even need to be a radio, I remember the Police car radio coming through my dads electronic organ, there is simply no point screening if the equipment is not designed to reject out of band transmissions.
So if your a radio ham and want to use QRP (word they use for very low power) and talk across the pond with 2 watt then maybe Ali-tube mains cables are worth while, but for most people it is not required.
Sponsored Links
- Joined
- 27 Jan 2008
- Messages
- 23,655
- Reaction score
- 2,663
- Location
- Llanfair Caereinion, Nr Welshpool
- Country
A new problem with powerline has come to light, as to if this is just a perceived problem, or real I don't know, the problem is with RCD's, there are four types of RCD, AC, A, F, B and it is down to if your likely to have pulsed DC, high frequency AC, or DC flowing through the RCD as well as the normal AC. So basic type is the AC, banned in many countries but not UK, and if you have a faulty diode on a power supply it can stop the RCD tripping, however the type A is readily available both as stand alone RCD and as combined with MCB as a RCBO.
However type F and B are not readily available as single width RCBO's and are expensive as RCD's. They are mainly used for solar panels and electric car chargers, and there is little else in the home that needs them, the type F can cope with high frequency AC superimposed on the supply, and this is what the powerline adaptors do.
Type F is designed mainly for solar panels where a fault on the inverter can cause high frequency AC. You can get RCBO's the DFS 2 F RCCB for example, but they are two module width, and looking at over £100 each.
I have hunted for more info as to if type F is required when using powerline adaptors, but can't really find any answers.
However type F and B are not readily available as single width RCBO's and are expensive as RCD's. They are mainly used for solar panels and electric car chargers, and there is little else in the home that needs them, the type F can cope with high frequency AC superimposed on the supply, and this is what the powerline adaptors do.
Type F is designed mainly for solar panels where a fault on the inverter can cause high frequency AC. You can get RCBO's the DFS 2 F RCCB for example, but they are two module width, and looking at over £100 each.
I have hunted for more info as to if type F is required when using powerline adaptors, but can't really find any answers.
Well I know what @winston1 would say; you shouldn't be using powering adapters in the first place, so the RCD issue goes away.
That's obviously not practical for some though. However, all the PLTs I have seen instructions for say that the connection isn't designed for going through the fuse board. It's meant to sit within a single 'ring', so from room to room on a single floor for example.
Human nature being what it is, people will disregard those and other instructions about the applicable uses of PLTs when it suits them, particularly with the appeal of being a low-cost solution.
If the answer though it one or two £100+ RCDs, then the pendulum swings towards accepting the cost of running CAT cable to do the job properly. That would be best for everyone where it is practical.
That's obviously not practical for some though. However, all the PLTs I have seen instructions for say that the connection isn't designed for going through the fuse board. It's meant to sit within a single 'ring', so from room to room on a single floor for example.
Human nature being what it is, people will disregard those and other instructions about the applicable uses of PLTs when it suits them, particularly with the appeal of being a low-cost solution.
If the answer though it one or two £100+ RCDs, then the pendulum swings towards accepting the cost of running CAT cable to do the job properly. That would be best for everyone where it is practical.
Last edited:
Indeed.
Why do you say that? If mains cable has been put through the house CAT5/6 can be. What would people do if PLT didn't exist? They would lay cables just like they do for aerial and satellite feeds. CAT5/6 is thinner and less obtrusive than RF cables as well.
For the most part, mains cable is laid during the building phase, you know, when the house is a shell and there are no proper floors or ceilings in place.
Installing new or replacement mains cable normally involves major disruption in the house, but that inconvenience is accepted as part of major changes such as an extension or significant safety upgrades.
All of the above are very different scenarios from someone in a finished house, you know, with finished floors down and furniture in place and a family in residence, who just wants to get an Internet connection from A to B in their home without turning the house upside down. I am surprised that I have to point out to you what most other people would see as a very obvious difference in the situations.
Do I really have to point out as well that aerial and satellite cable is often run on the outside of a building before being brought in to the final connection points? That's not to say that the same wouldn't be possible with outdoor grade CAT cable; but again in most ordinary people's view it's an OTT solution when all they need is a reliable Internet connection in some point in the middle of a house that's in a Wi-Fi dead spot.
If PLTs didn't exist then some would undoubtedly have to bite the bullet and put up with the disruption of lifting floors and redecorating after. I suspect many others would either make do with Wi-Fi repeaters/extenders or simply do without.
So you approve of people being selfish, causing interference to essential services and neighbours TV and radio reception, and putting themselves at risk due to possible RCD malfunction because doing it properly is OTT.
It is quite possible for PLT to interfere with planes thousands of feet up if this example is anything to go by even though the source in this occasion was not PLT.
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/about-ofcom/latest/features-and-news/interference-issue
Boy, oh boy, have you got the wrong person in your sights. It's really not a good plan to alienate the people that are actually on your side. In fact, it's the sort of thing a dick would do.
You're also displaying a distinct lack of empathy with your posts. Why are you so angry to lash out like this? I know you'll say it's about PLTs, but that's not really it, or not all of it. What's going on underneath that?
People will be selfish regardless of what I have to say on the subject. They won't call it being selfish. In fact, they won't think of it as being selfish at all. In their mind they're justified in finding a simple solution to their problem. Their logical argument would be that if these things are so bad to use then they shouldn't be on sale in the first place. It's hard to argue with that.
If you want to direct your energy somewhere then point your aggression at our Government for allowing PLTs to be sold.
I'm not having a go at you, I'm really not. I do agree it is the government's fault, possibly there are back handers going on from the industry.
As far as bad things being on sale, there are plenty of other examples, perhaps the worst example being tobacco.
As far as bad things being on sale, there are plenty of other examples, perhaps the worst example being tobacco.
The thing is though, @winston1, it came across exactly like you were having a go. It took me virtually reading the Riot Act out for you to stand back and see it from the other person's perspective. That's not good, mate.
There's an old saying, 'You catch more flies with honey than vinegar'.
I get the sense that you have a lot of valuable knowledge you could share, and folk could learn a lot from you. You could be a really good contributor to this forum...... Or do I have that wrong?
There's an old saying, 'You catch more flies with honey than vinegar'.
I get the sense that you have a lot of valuable knowledge you could share, and folk could learn a lot from you. You could be a really good contributor to this forum...... Or do I have that wrong?
DIYnot Local
Staff member
If you need to find a tradesperson to get your job done, please try our local search below, or if you are doing it yourself you can find suppliers local to you.
Select the supplier or trade you require, enter your location to begin your search.
Are you a trade or supplier? You can create your listing free at DIYnot Local
Sponsored Links
