Remove 2 way Switching

[Rob G20]

Hi All,
I'm really scratching my head here ! I've got 2 lights in a hallway, which have 2 switches (2 way switching) which operate both lights simultaneously. I want to separate the 2 way switching so each switch operates one light only. And i'm struggling getting my head around the wiring. To complicate things the powered smokes take their permanent feed from the lights too. I've attached some pics and a bit of a schematic. Any ideas how to separate the two; and is it possible given the wires already present ? Really appreciate some ideas please ! Cheers

 

[JohnW2]

I'm really scratching my head here ! I've got 2 lights in a hallway, which have 2 switches (2 way switching) which operate both lights simultaneously. I want to separate the 2 way switching so each switch operates one light only. And i'm struggling getting my head around the wiring. To complicate things the powered smokes take their permanent feed from the lights too. I've attached some pics and a bit of a schematic. Any ideas how to separate the two; and is it possible given the wires already present ? Really appreciate some ideas please !

I suspect that's going to be less-than-straightforward, and will require at least some additional cables to be run, since you don't currently have separate connections (to just one of the lights) available at either switch. Is the need for this important enough that you are prepared to get involved with additional wiring?

Kind Regards, John

 

[Rob G20]

Thanks for the reply John. Yes I can run some new wires to separate it all out. (We've partitioned the hallway and created a small annexe for my son - so at the moment we keep switching each others lights on and off !) - Ideally any new wiring would be to light 2 and switch 2 (As i've yet to decorate so could chase out to the switch and replaster if needed)

 

[ericmark]

If I was wring two lights from two two way switches it would be power to one lamp, the that would go to one switch and to other lamp, and from the one switch to other switch, so with that wiring there is no way to re-configure to work two lights independently.

So likely way is kinetic switching, i.e. there is a radio link switch to light rather than a wired link, but this is expensive, so how much are you willing to pay? In my house the hub cost £48, the switch cost £24.50 and the remote cost £12 there are cheaper, I used energenie and also have TRV on same system to work central heating, but the point is not cheap.

So it is a balance new cables or wireless?

 

[EFLImpudence]

This is what you have - I think - anyone disagree?

Give me a while.

 

[JohnW2]

Thanks for the reply John. Yes I can run some new wires to separate it all out. (We've partitioned the hallway and created a small annexe for my son - so at the moment we keep switching each others lights on and off !) - Ideally any new wiring would be to light 2 and switch 2 (As i've yet to decorate so could chase out to the switch and replaster if needed)

Fair enough.

I suppose the first thing that needs to be done is to get the two lights separated. At present, they are presumably connected together (but goodness knows where), so you would need to find and remove that connection and re-arrange things that you had one cable going from each light to the corresponding switch.

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

This is what you have - I think - anyone disagree?

AS I've just written, I don't think that we can be sure where the two lights are connected - it might, for example, be at a ('hidden') JB somewhere, mightn't it?

Kind Regards, John

 

[EFLImpudence]

Anything is possible but the cables seem to be what would be expected.

 

[Rob G20]

Thanks all for the help and advice. I had no idea it'd be as complicated as it is ! I can 'get' to switch 2 wiring in the roofspace; and maybe even to the top of light 2. I wonder if I can re-use the wires to switch 2 buried in the wall by getting in the roof, cutting the wire and putting a junction box to replicate the switch 2 wiring; and leave all the 2 way switching (in principle); and then extend the cut switch 2 wiring to a new cable to the light fitting or indeed a new light in the ceiling; and put all light 2 into a JB in the roof and leave as is ? Make any sense ?!

 

[EFLImpudence]

If I am right, then you will need either

another cable from light 2 to switch 2, or it could be done with

another cable - 3 core + E instead of the 2 core + E - from light 1 to switch 1

whichever is easier.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Though is it worth it?

 

[JohnW2]

Anything is possible but the cables seem to be what would be expected.

Yes, what you have suggested is certainly consistent with what we've been told, although other things are oresumably ';possible'.

If you're right, then presumably what would be needed (to do it one way - there are other possibilities) would be an 'extra conductor' from Light 1 to Switch 1 (perhaps by changing the existing T+_E to 3C+E), to carry the S/L for Light 2, and then a connector block/Wago/whatever at Switch 1 to connect that S/L to the cable going to Switch 2 (plus the appropriate changes to connections o switches)?

Kind Regards, John
Edit: Damnit - typed too slowly again

 

[SUNRAY]

If I am right, then you will need either

another cable from light 2 to switch 2, or it could be done with

another cable - 3 core + E instead of the 2 core + E - from light 1 to switch 1

whichever is easier.

To simplify this a little it can be done with an extra cable from either light to either switch, ie 4 different options, whichever route and access to accessories is easiest.

This assumes the wiring is as EFL has described [and is also my likliest interpretation].

 

[Rob G20]

Thanks for all the advice guys - the wiring diagram is certainly useful and once drawn like that makes a huge amount more sense. I'll use this to do a continuity test to check and confirm what goes where before i jump in. In any case looks like i might need to be adding some wire (or investigating the wireless option !) - Cheers all.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Depending on the layout, I suppose you just could be lucky and find the cable between the switches runs in the ceiling past the two lights.

On the other hand...