Stubborn builder fit backboxes flush with plaster, can't fit sockets in.

[several]

Having a debate with my builder(I'm the customer). He's fit 25mm backboxes *completely* flush with the plaster so getting any nice sockets to fit is nigh on impossible. He's blames me saying I should have provided the backboxes myself ?

The fact is though, the metal backboxes were already fit on a stud wall(set 35mm deep), he needed to increase the depth of the wall by 25mm and he decided to move the backboxes forward (instead of just relying on longer screws on the sockets) and moved them to be completely flush with the plaster. He said during the build 'you'll be fitting nice brushed sockets yea'.

So now he says "Tell you what, go on a builders forum and tell them you’re complaining about perfectly flush back boxes, then open your Brolley to weather the ****storm .you talk some proper ****e sometimes. Go to fekkin sleep ffs"

So, here we are. He thinks I'm a complete ****, I think he doesn't think ahead. Even 90% of cheap white moulded plastic sockets won't fit

 

[securespark]

############

Did you explain to your builder before the alterations of your need for 35mm depth?

White sockets, as long as they are not flatplate should fit 25mm as long as there are not more than 2 cables.

 

[Notch7]

Back boxes are pennies, wouldnt most people fit new 35mm for sockets. Its not easy getting cables for a ring in 25mm even with std white.

 

[Notch7]

Your builder is a very doplomatic man

 

[several]

I didn't ask him to move the backboxes. He did it himself for reasons unknown, he assumed I was using nice brushed sockets all along as most people tend to do when fitting a nice expensive new kitchen.

 

[securespark]

Did he know you would need extra depth?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

He said during the build 'you'll be fitting nice brushed sockets yea'.

I'm confused - do you mean he thought you were going to use flat-plate accessories, and then did what you describe to the boxes so that you can't?

Even 90% of cheap white moulded plastic sockets won't fit

So what will fit?

And for the ones that won't, is it the overall depth that's the problem, or the fact that the boxes are flush with the plaster? If he'd installed 47mm boxes "*completely* flush with the plaster" would you be OK?

he assumed I was using nice brushed sockets all along as most people tend to do when fitting a nice expensive new kitchen.

But it sounds as if what he did is at odds with such an assumption.

I didn't ask him to move the backboxes. He did it himself for reasons unknown

I suggest not paying him until he rectifies the changes he was not supposed to make.

 

[John D v2.0]

I thought brushed was a finish, not a shape? Flush is the shape.
Maybe there has been a bit of miscommunication.
Are you saying you think he did it on purpose to annoy you? If so you've got bigger problems than a few sockets.
I think your best bet is to just move them back your self or go for standard sockets instead of flush. Failing that try to persuade him to do it. But you'll have to do it using persuasion rather than threats, as it's going to be hard to come to any meaningful conclusion, and you're going to have to work with him for the rest of t build presumably, and want to keep your sanity.

 

[John D v2.0]

I didn't ask him to move the backboxes. He did it himself for reasons unknown, he assumed I was using nice brushed sockets all along as most people tend to do when fitting a nice expensive new kitchen.

I remember a very similar post recently on another section about a dispute that started with the implicit assumption that a loft void is for storage. The post went on for a while involved a lot of stress and argument but I don't know the outcome.
Your case is much more in your favour then that posters due to the fact there was nothing in the specification to modify the sockets, so you have a good chance of persuading the builder to rectify.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

He does not sound like anybody who lives in the land of reason, or reasonableness.

If he goes around *****ng things up on his own initiative, and becomes abusive when his gratuitous ****-ups are challenged, then sanity says kick him into touch before things go from bad to worse.

 

[SimonH2]

It's a bit of "6 of one, half a dozen of the other" IMO.
Had the builder left the backboxes as they were then the fronts would be around 35mm behind the plaster - that's a right PITA to work around, especially for the plasterer who would be expected to make a nice rectangular hole with a flat face and straight sides. As such, it's not unreasonable to have moved or replaced them - but as he's left you with 10mm less depth than you had, he should have asked first.

Fitting 47mm boxes as a direct swap for the 25mm ones (and without any packing behind) would have left them just 13mm behind the plaster, which is a bit more manageable.

As it is, I assume there's a 35mm spacer behind the boxes. I'd just take the boxes out and fit deeper ones with a thinner packing behind them. I take it the wall is now plastered ? Is it finished (painted or whatever finish it's having) ?
As long as the builder didn't glue them in too tight with the plaster, it should be possible to carefully cut around the box with a hacksaw blade - obviously take care not to cut your cables ! The hardest part is that you need to tilt the boxes to get them out as the cables are behind the plasterboard, and the deeper the box, the more height is needed - you'll see what I mean when you try it.

When you've done, you'll need to finish off again with some filler or plaster - I generally use Polyfiller (or similar) for this sort of thing.

 

[OwainDIYer]

Had the builder left the backboxes as they were then the fronts would be around 35mm behind the plaster - that's a right PITA to work around,

And a lot of more expensive socket styles have colour-matched screws, which won't be long enough and for which obtaining longer ones is at the discretion of the manufacturer

 

[SimonH2]

And a lot of more expensive socket styles have colour-matched screws, which won't be long enough and for which obtaining longer ones is at the discretion of the manufacturer

Extenders

 

[333rocky333]

If he had not moved the boxes, then they would have become 70mm deep with a 35mm gap between the box and the finished wall, which seems a bit excessive to me, in the past i have found mice in backboxes, the point of a backbox is to also encase the wiring, not just to screw the socket too.

If he is used to using brushed sockets, some of which have matching dedicated fixing screws rather than the normal nickel plated ones, rather than faffing round with extension pillars, he did what he did.

Sounds too me as if the original boxes were the wrong depth if they had to be set back anyway, flush boxes surely are designed to be flush and in the days of proper wall plastering they were, but now no one appears to bother, relying on the plasterer to form an edge then whinge when he gets plaster in the box, with boarding its usually easier to set them a fraction back but no need for more than 10mm .

 

[securespark]

Extenders

Not from CEF.....

Then there was the time I wanted extension studs.

Oh don't buy the MK ones, they're mad dear, he said. Buy our own.

How much?

90p each.

If I buy 100 how much are they?

90p each.

You can't make it up.

Read more: https://www.diynot.com/diy/threads/extending-6mm-cable.383420/#ixzz58AXpltEt