1. Visiting from the US? Why not try DIYnot.US instead? Click here to continue to DIYnot.US.
    Dismiss Notice

Switching Fan / Lighting In Bathroom.

Discussion in 'Electrics UK' started by securespark, 4 Mar 2012.

  1. securespark

    securespark

    Joined:
    11 Jan 2004
    Messages:
    37,154
    Thanks Received:
    1,290
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Hi guys.

    I'm refurbing the bathroom at the moment.

    Wanting a TD350 SL to run all the time the room is occupied, then for an overrun period after the room is vacated. I don't want manual switch operation.

    So, I'm plumping for a ceiling-mounted PIR, set to operate at any time, with a 20 min. overrun.

    I'd also like to switch the lighting automatically too, but would like the lighting to operate independantly of the fan.This does not need overrun, but does need inhibiting during daylight hours.

    Rather than having two separate units, is there such a thing as a single ceiling PIR with two independent outputs? I can't seem to find anything.

    Just don't want to clutter the ceiling up with more than I have to.
     
  2. Sponsored Links
  3. ban-all-sheds

    ban-all-sheds

    Joined:
    27 Aug 2003
    Messages:
    69,782
    Thanks Received:
    2,858
    Location:
    London
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Even if someone has only gone in there for a few minutes to clean their teeth, of just a few seconds to open/close a window or a blind?

    Isn't that both pointless and wasteful?


    You do know that sooner or later that will drive you bonkers?


    Just what is wrong with a light switch?
     
  4. PrenticeBoyofDerry

    PrenticeBoyofDerry

    Joined:
    30 Jun 2009
    Messages:
    21,627
    Thanks Received:
    2,382
    Location:
    Londonderry
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    I want a unit that will not only operate light, fan whist in/out of room in daylight/night but also wipe my arse!
     
  5. JohnW2

    JohnW2

    Joined:
    28 Jan 2011
    Messages:
    48,661
    Thanks Received:
    3,191
    Location:
    Buckinghamshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    I think you probably can be fairly confident that such an animal does not exist. You're not only asking for 'independent outputs', but that one of them should have an over-run and the other have daylight inhibition (but not vice versa) - such an unusal requirement that I can't imagine the demand would be enough to justify such a product being produced. Furthermore, even if you had extensive electronic skills, butchering a PIR to achieve this functionality could be very difficult, and maybe impossible within the available space.

    I would also second what others have said about PIR-controlled lighting being a complete pain, once the novelty has worn off, and potentially dangerous in a bathroom.

    Kind Regards, John.
     
  6. EFLImpudence

    EFLImpudence

    Joined:
    7 Jul 2010
    Messages:
    37,461
    Thanks Received:
    4,203
    Location:
    Retired to:
    Country:
    Portugal
    Just to point out that the 'over-run' will be in the fan and not to do with the PIR.

    I suppose anything is possible these days.

    However, asking one 'eye' - without a nose or brain - to do what you want doesn't seem feasible.
     
  7. securespark

    securespark

    Joined:
    11 Jan 2004
    Messages:
    37,154
    Thanks Received:
    1,290
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Yes, want it on whenever the room is occupied. I shall use the TP switch outside if I need it off.

    The room suffers terribly from condensation and mould, despite having a window.

    However, I am open to suggestions.

    Thinking of 2 x 28W 2D fittings switched from a PIR with an overrun that should stop it switching off when you've got shampoo in your eyes...

    Again, open to suggestions.

    What is wrong with a light switch?

    Well, what I didn't say is that I have three boys aged between 7 and 12.

    I don't want the switch on the outside as they will act the goat and turn it off when someone is inside...

    I don't want it inside because the only place it can go would be close to a shower cubicle, which, owing to the direction of the joists, needs to be raised up on a step to allow for the waste pipe. This would bring the switch body into Z2.

    Now, I could do what I did in the boys' bedrooms and fit an SELV PTM switch, linked to a relay.

    What would you do?
     
  8. ban-all-sheds

    ban-all-sheds

    Joined:
    27 Aug 2003
    Messages:
    69,782
    Thanks Received:
    2,858
    Location:
    London
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    With a PIR, a light sensor and a bit of logic it could easily be implemented.

    But why would you?
     
  9. securespark

    securespark

    Joined:
    11 Jan 2004
    Messages:
    37,154
    Thanks Received:
    1,290
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    No, I've checked with S&P and TLC...that fan has no timer, so the overrun would be set on the PIR.
     
  10. Sponsored Links
  11. JohnW2

    JohnW2

    Joined:
    28 Jan 2011
    Messages:
    48,661
    Thanks Received:
    3,191
    Location:
    Buckinghamshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    The fan is question does not have a timer - but, even if he used one which did have, the requirement for one standard output and one daylight-inhibit output would almost certainly make his desires insatiable in terms of 'off-the-shelf' products!

    Kind Regards, John
     
  12. EFLImpudence

    EFLImpudence

    Joined:
    7 Jul 2010
    Messages:
    37,461
    Thanks Received:
    4,203
    Location:
    Retired to:
    Country:
    Portugal
    I have noticed this response several times lately.

    I do admit to being a grumpy old git, but is it too much to expect children to be brought up properly and behave responsibly or
    do they pretend they are in a supermarket ALL the time?

    Redesign the house because there are children.
     
  13. securespark

    securespark

    Joined:
    11 Jan 2004
    Messages:
    37,154
    Thanks Received:
    1,290
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Hmmmm... :eek:


    OK. I'm now understanding that you don't like PIR's for lighting control.

    You reckon the fan should not be on all the time someone is in the room.

    My requirements are that the fan needs to be foolproof operation, IE it should not be possible to use the bathroom without the fan operating. A PIR with delayed start??

    For the lighting, I don't want a switch outside or an LV pullcord inside.

    Maybe an SELV switching system?

    How would you do it?
     
  14. JohnW2

    JohnW2

    Joined:
    28 Jan 2011
    Messages:
    48,661
    Thanks Received:
    3,191
    Location:
    Buckinghamshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Ceiling-mounted pull switches are widely used in bathrooms, aren't they?

    Kind Regards, John.
     
  15. securespark

    securespark

    Joined:
    11 Jan 2004
    Messages:
    37,154
    Thanks Received:
    1,290
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Yes, but the body of the switch must not be in Z2.
     
  16. securespark

    securespark

    Joined:
    11 Jan 2004
    Messages:
    37,154
    Thanks Received:
    1,290
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    I'll just repost this bit as I was adding it when you posted, John.
     
  17. JohnW2

    JohnW2

    Joined:
    28 Jan 2011
    Messages:
    48,661
    Thanks Received:
    3,191
    Location:
    Buckinghamshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    I do think that PIRs for indoor lighting is not a very good idea, particularly in places (like bathrooms) where sudden and unexpected disappearance loss of light could present a particular hazard. However, although others have mentioned it, I would personally not have a problem with the fan always been on when (and after) someone was in the room.

    Like most people, I'd probably do one of the two things you don't want to do. If you feel that you must avoid both those options, then I suppose that SELV switching would be one answer, but it does seem a bit OTT! As bernardgreen has recently written in another thread, I suppose that a pneumatically operated switch would be another possibility.

    Kind Regards, John.
     
Loading...

Share This Page