WARNING = Highway Code Changes - A disaster in the making

[AngleEyes]

Correct - but they exist and telling a cyclist to "block" them is nuts.

Who has been advising cyclists to block in motorists?

 

[Trazor]

.

 

[Trazor]

I had to come on my bike.

 

[motorbiking]

Who has been advising cyclists to block in motorists?

https://www.cyclinguk.org/article/road-positioning-cycling-explained

those who think the primary position is good practice.

 

[Deleted member 18243]

the new law says you should stop mid-turn for anyone standing on the pavement waiting to cross, which is madness.

I have had second thoughts about this. It is madness to think that people in today's world would change their behaviour and do this, but it would be great if it did happen. I'd be happy to do it, because as Ross Clark says it is an example of how a conservative government can promote civilised values.

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/entitled-motorists-have-ruled-the-roads-for-far-too-long

How is it going to work in practice though, especially on fast, busy A-roads? Will it be just another law that nobody gets done for? Tailgating was made a specific offence a few years ago but I've never heard of anyone being prosecuted for it.

 

[AngleEyes]

https://www.cyclinguk.org/article/road-positioning-cycling-explained

those who think the primary position is good practice.

Can you see the difference between "blocking in motorists", and "deterring unsafe overtakes"?
Frequently, the motorist's desire to pass a cyclist overcomes their ability to overtake safely.
Then it's usually the cyclist that suffers the consequences, and this happens when the cyclist is riding in the gutter.

 

[AngleEyes]

How is it going to work in practice though, especially on fast, busy A-roads? Will it be just another law that nobody gets done for?

Many fast, busy A-roads do not have such junctions that would create problems. In fact many fast, busy A-roads do not even have pavements.

 

[AngleEyes]

View attachment 258649

Ding-a-ling.

 

[motorbiking]

Can you see the difference between "blocking in motorists", and "deterring unsafe overtakes"?
Frequently, the motorist's desire to pass a cyclist overcomes their ability to overtake safely.
Then it's usually the cyclist that suffers the consequences, and this happens when the cyclist is riding in the gutter.

Blocking in motorists - Was your phrase. I said “block”. Any attempt to deliberately deter someone from doing what they think is possible and safe, is likely to result in either them doing it anyway (now with less space) or them getting aggressive. It’s not safe for any vulnerable road user to position themselves in an attempt to control others driving.

 

[AngleEyes]

Blocking in motorists - Was your phrase. I said “block”. Any attempt to deliberately deter someone from doing what they think is possible and safe, is likely to result in either them doing it anyway (now with less space) or them getting aggressive. It’s not safe for any vulnerable road user to position themselves in an attempt to control others driving.

Sigh!
You did say 'block them', and as you said it in response to my comment about motorists overtaking, the "them" could only refer to motorists, being blocked by cyclists.

To block - make the movement or flow in (a passage, pipe, road, etc.) difficult or impossible.​

The Highway code refers to deterring, not to blocking.

​

 

[motorbiking]

I would never consider a riding plan that involved positioning to make another road user do or not do something that I thought they were planning. The simple fact is they probably won’t behave as you’d planned.

motorcycles have the advantage of speed, cyclists don’t. There are many aspects of road craft that don’t transfer to cycles. Have you read roadcraft?

 

[AngleEyes]

motorcycles have the advantage of speed, cyclists don’t. There are many aspects of road craft that don’t transfer to cycles. Have you read roadcraft?

We're not discussing the tactics of motorbiking compared to cyclists. Only you are comparing the two.
It's like discussing the sailing of yachts with power craft. They are different.

 

[IT Minion]

I would never consider a riding plan that involved positioning to make another road user do or not do something that I thought they were planning. The simple fact is they probably won’t behave as you’d planned.

motorcycles have the advantage of speed, cyclists don’t. There are many aspects of road craft that don’t transfer to cycles. Have you read roadcraft?

Are there any significant bodies of cyclists who don't agree with the prime position? I don't know of any but you do have strong feelings on this so I was wondering if you knew of any.

Is it possible you're an outlier on this?

 

[motorbiking]

@AngleEyes - So you agree that it would potentially be unwise to take a best practice guide written for motorcycles and adapt it to cycles?

@IT Minion - all of the groups I used to ride (MTB, road and TT) with will typically take the secondary position on busy roads. Many of the chat forums are critical of the prime position, unless approaching junctions. On TT events the advice was to take the secondary position.

There seems to be several factions, those who don’t drive and those who do. For those who do, the wisdom of prime is challenged. For those who don’t there seems to be a car hating mantra. The guy who wrote cycle craft fits in to the second group.

 

[AngleEyes]

So you agree that it would potentially be unwise to take a best practice guide written for motorcycles and adapt it to cycles?

Give us some specific examples. I'm sure the whole caboodle is not transferable, nor, I don't suppose, has anyone suggested it is.
As far as I am aware, you are the only one insisting on the comparisons.