Who is professionally competent to relocate a CH radiator?

[andytw]

As was pointed out to me once, a 'Professional' is just someone who gets paid to do something.
I think the connection between it's perceived meaning of 'Quality' is long gone....sorry

I would have thought that, in this case, anyone who says they can do the work, and then provide an invoice would be a professional.

andytw

 

[JohnD]

a radiator doesn't have gas in it, it has water.

So you don't need a gasman.

Topping up the water pressure is a job which the boiler manufacturer's instructions will (with almost no doubt) show as a "user's" or "householder's" task.

 

[richard7761]

I think what perhaps I should do is ask for quotes just making sure the person is gas safe registered. Pick the cheapest quote, whatever the tradesman's official designation, and give their name into the council. Let the council accept or reject.

 

[richard7761]

a radiator doesn't have gas in it, it has water.

So you don't need a gasman.

Topping up the water pressure is a job which the boiler manufacturer's instructions will (with almost no doubt) show as a "user's" or "householder's" task.

Correct in general, but it get's more complicated when council property is concered.

 

[biscuit77]

Are you not listening to what everyone s saying to you?. You DO NOT need to be gas safe registered to move a radiator or repressurise your boiler. Any plumber,handyman or person that is competant can do this job. Its not a hard job.

 

[seco services]

Correct in general, but it get's more complicated when council property is concered.

The council just read off the same song sheet.
I once was asked to prove i was corgi reg to change a immersion element in a cylinder in a property that didn't even have gas supply.

 

[JohnD]

you also don't need a gasman to change a washer on a hot tap.

Even if the hot water is heated by a boiler.

 

[D_Hailsham]

The council wants a professional to relocate the radiator.

Put the ball back in the council's court - ask them what qualifications the "professional" person must have.

Yes, I think I ought to do that.

They mentioned "Gas engineer" in their letter. Don't know why.

I suspect that when we contemplate the matter, we might say anything from plumber, gas fitter, gas engineer, to heating engineer is professionally competent. Any of those mentioned who have a gas safety registration number.

But whether the council say that, well, I'll find out.

I don't know what particular qualification the council expect the gas engineer to have, as Gassafe does not have a specific competence for "installing radiators" and the "pipework" competence only covers gas pipework.

The ironic thing is that, being a simple task, the "gassafe registered engineer" could quite easily send along his "unqualified" mate or even an apprentice to do the job.

 

[richard7761]

The council wants a professional to relocate the radiator.

Put the ball back in the council's court - ask them what qualifications the "professional" person must have.

Yes, I think I ought to do that.

They mentioned "Gas engineer" in their letter. Don't know why.

I suspect that when we contemplate the matter, we might say anything from plumber, gas fitter, gas engineer, to heating engineer is professionally competent. Any of those mentioned who have a gas safety registration number.

But whether the council say that, well, I'll find out.

I don't know what particular qualification the council expect the gas engineer to have, as Gassafe does not have a specific competence for "installing radiators" and the "pipework" competence only covers gas pipework.

The ironic thing is that, being a simple task, the "gassafe registered engineer" could quite easily send along his "unqualified" mate or even an apprentice to do the job.

Excellent points.

The main thing is will I be spending more than I reasonably should in paying a tradesman? That is the crucial thing.

I read this on some sites: "Please remember: by law, repairs to gas boilers can only be carried out by registered engineers. "

Anyway, it looks like the council are stipulating that anyone touching their CH property, must be legally qualified. Okay, fine in general. They are using terms such as "Gas Engineer" and requiring gas safe registration when touching upon the qualification.

I was thinking Gas Engineer and Gas Safe was meant to mean, by implication, a tradesman qualified to deal with the CH system in any capacity. But can you make such an implication? Does it make sense?

 

[richard7761]

What I'm thinking is this, lets say that the council have engaged heating engineers, to look after all the CH systems. Let's say that this firm is Gas Safe. Also, they call themselves Gas Engineers. Now, when a boiler goes faulty they send out people from this firm. But, what happens if you put a hole in the CH pipe? Do they send out people from the same firm. If they do, this is possibly why the council is saying I need a Gas Engineer, and to send in the Gas Safe number. Just because the firm who deals with their CH systems calls themselves Gas Engineers and is of course Gas Safe and deal with all aspects relating to the CH systems.

 

[richard7761]

Really, Gas Engineer is to be translated as Heating Engineer. I think that is what is going on. That may make it more expensive for me, than it ought to be- maybe.

The council want a gas safe number, simply to prove the heating engineer.

 

[loafer]

The basic fact is that you rent the property. The property and all of the fixed installations vis-a-vis gas, cold water, domestic hot water, circulating/pressurised central heating water, electrical and possibly appliances (certainly including the boiler) oven? wash mac? are the property of the council. You are going to great lengths to ensure that any work that you are willing to pay for should be carried out by an appropriately accredited and reliable tradesperson.

This is a credit to you; after all if anything should go disastrously wrong... you would be liable as the (sub)contracting party. If the council decides to appoint someone to carry out the work..... then they will have the legal responsibility to ensure that the work is carried out by a competent person. An individual or sub-contracted organisation with all of the necessary third party insurance... just in case!!! In all likelihood the council will not allow you to appoint someone to carry out the work.

I have rented out tennanted properties and would not allow my tennants to get someone in to even change a lightbulb! Not least tinker with the central heating system!

It is inevitable that should you wish to pursue this option that it would inevitably take much longer given the amount of administrative work involved notwithstanding the fact that they will probably give you a time window regarding carrying out the work which will mean that you will have to stay in on any appointed day.... listlessly staring out the window waiting for the plumber....YES PLUMBER to turn up to carry out the work.
If you choose to engage the services of a tradesperson to carry out this work you should;
1 ask someone a friend, colleague, relative, neighbour if they can recommend someone
2 Ask the attending person for additional references
3 Ask the person for evidence of trade affiliation membership, qualifications and evidence that they are suitably insured.... just in case!


Have you also considered that if you vacate, the property the council may also charge you for returning the rad to its original position?

Regardless of either option that you should choose to pursue... there are a number of issues that need to be noted/considered.

Has the boiler been serviced in the last 12 months? It should have been?! Have you got your copy of the gas safe certificate (landlord certification) Have you got a copy of the service interval record for the boiler/central heating system? This will need to be inspected by whomsoever is to carry out the work to ensure that the boiler is safe, functioning correctly, has a log of any servicing or repair work and at the very least "has been flushed in accordance with the manufacturers instructions and has been dosed appropriately with the correct amount of central heating inhibitor."

Basically, whatever route you take wish to take on the record with l/l (council consent) Off the record for your convenience and pocket depth you must ensure that the person appointed is competent and covered for your own piece of mind more than anything else.

If you get a friend of a friend from down the pub to do the job and you argue the toss over how much dosh s/he wants expect problems.

Pay peanuts=get monkeys

 

[HERTS P&D]

All I can hear from the OP is CHEAP/CHEAP/CHEAP.

Lets hope the guy who does the work can speak English and has PL.

Andy

 

[richard7761]

We must not get off track here:

* Approval has already been sought for the work of removing a radiator

* In response, I have been told by the council what to do already, in terms of two conditions: That is to give them the name of a gas engineer and the gas safe number.

* When you examine it, I have concluded that in all probability, all that the council are really saying, in their two conditions, is - give me the name of a heating engineer and their gas safe number. Because, who can tell exactly what a gas engineer is qualified to do! Not easy.

* The issue is who is professionally competent. I believe a plumber is actually competent and (perhaps) a gas fitter. As well as any professional calling themselves a gas engineer, or heating engineer.

* What I am trying to do is avoid paying a heating engineer, if it's more costly than paying a plumber. That might mean the plumber is not gas safe. But, technically that ought not to matter, because it's hardly an advantage to be gas safe in this situation. But, knowing the council they may well insist on a heating engineer, or a gas engineer with gas safety. Thus potentially upping my costs.

* I ought to challenge the council by asking - can a plumber do this work of relocating a CH radiator.

 

[OwainDIYer]

I suspect the council assume plumber = gas safe because they probably put all their in-house plumbers through gas safe certification.

However what the council *really* want (although they may not know it) is for you to use a proper tradesman with liability insurance so if the new radiator leaks and the floorboards rot and the house falls down, the council aren't left with the bill.