Wide bore pipes (and many other things...!)

[doitall]

be wary of cast iron rads on new boilers, apparently some manufacturers do not approve

Don't use their boilers then

 

[twgas]

be wary of cast iron rads on new boilers, apparently some manufacturers do not approve

Don't use their boilers then

I dont do installs so i dont use any boilers (just bits of them)

 

[doitall]

be wary of cast iron rads on new boilers, apparently some manufacturers do not approve

Don't use their boilers then

I dont do installs so i dont use any boilers (just bits of them)

Not a problem then I will say the Magnaclean is good for older type system.

 

[Agile]

An Ethos will deliver 23 litres/min, that is unvented cylinder territory. Backup? Put an instant electric heater in the combi outlet. Want a secondary circulation loop to give instant DHW at the taps? They have one. All done!!

The Ethos is highly cost effective..and delivers.

Now to heat 23 li/min with an electric heater will require about 60 kW.

That will need a 300 Amp supply ( to include a little domestic).

Even if the power supplier agree, that will cost a lot to upgrade the street/cable!

Tony

 

[Doctor Drivel]

An Ethos will deliver 23 litres/min, that is unvented cylinder territory. Backup? Put an instant electric heater in the combi outlet. Want a secondary circulation loop to give instant DHW at the taps? They have one. All done!!

The Ethos is highly cost effective..and delivers.

Now to heat 23 li/min with an electric heater will require about 60 kW.

Not this plantpot again! The electric is for "backup".

 

[simond]

I really don't think a combi on an old steel piped system is a good idea.

The heat exchanger will be subject to a load of crud - the Magnaclean whilst good is designed to let the crud pass once it (quickly) fills up. Furthermore the Magnaclean only pulls ferrous detritus from the water.

If you must have an instantaneous supply the ACV Heatmaster 35 does not have a heat exchanger that can fill up with debris and can be attached to gravity pressure or pressurised CH and HW if needed. But it is pricey.

I'd suggest an old fashioned boiler such as a Kidd for this application if the budget will stretch.

Whatever happens, it should be retained as an open vent system, because as your adviser suggested, those lovely iron rads may not hold up under a sealed system.

 

[doitall]

I would suggest an condensing boiler, such as the Broag Remeha, with an large vertical header that would act as an sludge pot, (bit like an Gledhill store) and an Magnaclean on the return to the boiler/s

 

[Doctor Drivel]

I really don't think a combi on an old steel piped system is a good idea.

The heat exchanger will be subject to a load of crud - the Magnaclean whilst good is designed to let the crud pass once it (quickly) fills up. Furthermore the Magnaclean only pulls ferrous detritus from the water.

I would be inclined to get a superior catch-all filter, like the Spirovent, than the Magnaclean. The Magnaclean does allow solids to catch as the bottom of the canister.

If you must have an instantaneous supply the ACV Heatmaster 35 does not have a heat exchanger that can fill up with debris and can be attached to gravity pressure or pressurised CH and HW if needed. But it is pricey.

Firstly the ACV is a stainless steel all through, so a quality product. If you want cheapo stuff go BIASI. At around £2.5K is is not expensive when you look at a quality SS boiler and a quality SS cylinder and quality controls with them too. And then the labour putting it all in. The HeatMaster is one box - a floor mounted combi. They you can't engineer the two separate products to be as efficient as the well engineered, all done for you, HeatMaster.

Also flue flexibility is good on the ACV too. As as you have noted it can be pressurised or vented CH and DHW.

Just do some sums. Don't arm wave.

I'd suggest an old fashioned boiler such as a Kidd for this application if the budget will stretch.

I like the Kidd, however it needs a U16 meter. If you want a boiler to be around in 30 years time, buy a Kidd - however gas would have run out by then.

Whatever happens, it should be retained as an open vent system, because as your adviser suggested, those lovely iron rads may not hold up under a sealed system.

Cast iron rads pop at 1 to 2 bar? Not in my world they do.

 

[simond]

The size of meter is obviously related to the size of boiler, Kidds start at 25kW, then 46kW etc so I don't see your point.

Interestingly, Kidd boilers are not on the internet which might explain your misunderstanding?

The rads can fail on the joints between sections at sealed system pressures, best not go there and then there's not a problem.

 

[doitall]

The size of meter is obviously related to the size of boiler, Kidds start at 25kW, then 46kW etc so I don't see your point.

Interestingly, Kidd boilers are not on the internet which might explain your misunderstanding?

The rads can fail on the joints between sections at sealed system pressures, best not go there and then there's not a problem.

I would not be concerned about the rads leaking and in any case they cane be broken down and re-washered.

My concern would be the joints and general condition of the pipework, although a good visual check would tell a lot.

 

[monkeybird]

Thanks for your replies - much appreciated and v technical so will wade through and Google everything...

Just being an ordinary punter would appreciate guidance on things like where to find/who to install older style boilers such as the Kidd? Is a Magnaclean (this observation from the DH!) the same Magnaclean you find on a scooter engine that basically attracts bits of metal etc?

Was advised by another plumber this very morning that it would be possible to fit a boiler (he mostly does Worcester Bosch) but refitting all the controls would be necessary... Bit more positive.

But would really like to find, as someone put it, a dinosaur who has worked with this kind of system...

 

[JohnD]

the Magnaclean for Central Heating is fitted on a return pipe to the boiler (usually 22mm but there might be a huge industrial one for your big pipes). It contains a powerful magnet that traps black iron oxide particles (but not other stuff) and it can easily be opened to remove the trapped sludge. You need to give the system a clean and drain as well, to remove non-black rubbish and to loosen whatever remains (you can never get it all out)

the common one costs about £100

I am just a householder but I fitted one on an old system and was pleased and gratified to see what a lot of sludge it collected. After 6 months (!) it is now collecting very little as presumably it has caught all the sediment from the circulating water.

lots more on
//www.diynot.com/search/forum....t=0&author=&search=Search+Forum&mode=advanced

 

[dedzed]

carbon monoxide has NO smell no taste and is not visible in the air and your blood happily absorbs it replacing vital oxygen.... you will only notice it once you are comatose and your soul starts to vacate your body.... "Just go towards the light"
do get a carbon monoxide detector especially the ones with a audible alarm as it may slip your complacent mind to check a visual one....
" and it's five six seven open up the pearly gates well there ain't no time to wonder why .... whoopee were all gonna die"