Sharia law

[zanwan]

Does the Quran advocate killing, injuring or persecuting people who question it?

no

Qur’an:9:5 “Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.”

Qur’an:8:39 “Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah.”


Qur’an:8:39 “So fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief [non-Muslims]) and all submit to the religion of Allah alone (in the whole world).”

Dude can you please, please please NOT quote the Quran totally out of context please? The verses your referring to were in regards to a war between Muslims and Non-Muslims in the Meccan era.

In regards to "Fitnah", Fitnah does not mean disbelief. Fitnah in arabic translates of "corruption, murder, crime, trouble".

I also notice you put all these "eye openers" in brackets? Why? Why do you need to add in a bit more sensationalised nonsense in brackets to make you misinterpretations even more eye-catching?

Dude i know my faith in depth and i will not allow you to misquote verses from the Quran without correcting you.

 

[zanwan]

The human body is the perfect design, yet you say it created itself?!

No such thing as perfect; just fit or unfit for purpose.

To use your own analogy, you are the car claiming to know humans created it.

I always find it incredibly arrogant when someone claims to know there is a god when the truth is I don’t know and neither do you my friend.

Well i chose to go on what i can see around me. The world is an incredible place, life is amazing and i really dont see how we just happen to have ended up here. I truly feel we are here for a bigger purpose and death is not the end.

But then i'm just a crazy religious guy.

 

[thatbloke]

Does the Quran advocate killing, injuring or persecuting people who question it?

no

Qur’an:9:5 “Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.”

Qur’an:8:39 “Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah.”


Qur’an:8:39 “So fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief [non-Muslims]) and all submit to the religion of Allah alone (in the whole world).”

Is that a direct translation word for word?
Or is it someones idea of a translation such as the many ways the bible can be translated?
Do you actually know or will you hazard a guess?

Please base your response on fact and if you can link to whatever source you use.

I found this , interesting because these verses are usually quoted out of context and i really doubt you have actually read the Qu ran.

http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100725110132AAVyIxO

 

[zanwan]

u can find the same sentiment in the bible

Where?

OK here are some things from the bible, i'm no expert but can any Christians conirm if these are true or not?

ill People Who Don't Listen to Priests

Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:12 NLT)



Kill Witches

You should not let a sorceress live. (Exodus 22:17 NAB)



Kill Homosexuals
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)



Kill Fortunetellers

A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27 NAB)



Death for Hitting Dad

Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15 NAB)



Death for Cursing Parents

1) If one curses his father or mother, his lamp will go out at the coming of darkness. (Proverbs 20:20 NAB)

2) All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. (Leviticus 20:9 NLT)



Death for Adultery

If a man commits adultery with another man's wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10 NLT)



Death for Fornication

A priest's daughter who loses her honor by committing fornication and thereby dishonors her father also, shall be burned to death. (Leviticus 21:9 NAB)



Death to Followers of Other Religions

Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed. (Exodus 22:19 NAB)



Kill Nonbelievers

They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB)

 

[spacecat]

But hey i'm just a mad raving looney Islamic nutter so ignore what i say.




I dont know raving looney nutter but certainly misguided and ignorant of basic
biology and and evolution.

The cars, electricity and glass you refer to came about because the HUMAN BRAIN EVOLVED to be able to develop tools to construct such things


Your idiotic notion that the HUMAN form is somehow perfect is also utter nonsense

The human body has many faults which can be directly linked back to its earlier forms evolutionary wise

Lets educate a little shall we

We have problematic backs a race because our backs are not fully designed to stand straight they are based on an animal that walks on all fours

we have the remnants of a tail bone in our pelvis

webbing between fingers and toes

far more body fat than many other land animals

The list goes ON AND ON!

Natural selection has determined which characteristics work well and over millions years they have become the dominant features the front facing eyes (ACTUALLY PRESENT IN MOST ANIMALS).

overall ourshape is succesful but it is FAR from perfect and given time (IF WE DONT DESTROY OURSELVES)
we may evolve even further.

 

[thatbloke]

Why are you all having a go at this guy because of his religion or because he is religious?
Isnt it better to accept the fact that someone does believe in god and live and let live?

 

[zanwan]

But hey i'm just a mad raving looney Islamic nutter so ignore what i say.





Your idiotic notion that the HUMAN form is somehow perfect is also utter nonsense

Really? So you think the body is not the perfect design? I chose to strongly disagree.

The human body has many faults which can be directly linked back to its earlier forms evolutionary wise

Lets educate a little shall we

We have problematic backs a race because our backs are not fully designed to stand straight they are based on an animal that walks on all fours

poor comeback. We dont have problematic backs as an inherent trait in human biology. Those with bad backs often have them due to certain lifestyles and jobs.

we have the remnants of a tail bone in our pelvis

LOL! OK is that why your called Cat?

webbing between fingers and toes

As a deformity.

far more body fat than many other land animals

Again often down to lifestyle choices.

The list goes ON AND ON!

Sorry but your arguments are weak, your clutching at straws.

overall ourshape is succesful but it is FAR from perfect and given time (IF WE DONT DESTROY OURSELVES)
we may evolve even further.

Thats a weak argument, and pretty much clutching at straws the way Darwin did.

If your theory is true, one day humans will have wings and be able to fly. So, do you feel this will be the case?

 

[Ricardus]

u can find the same sentiment in the bible

Where?

OK here are some things from the bible, i'm no expert but can any Christians conirm if these are true or not?

ill People Who Don't Listen to Priests

Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:12 NLT)

Kill Witches

You should not let a sorceress live. (Exodus 22:17 NAB)

Kill Homosexuals
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

Kill Fortunetellers

A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27 NAB)

Death for Hitting Dad

Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15 NAB)

Death for Cursing Parents

1) If one curses his father or mother, his lamp will go out at the coming of darkness. (Proverbs 20:20 NAB)

2) All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. (Leviticus 20:9 NLT)

Death for Adultery

If a man commits adultery with another man's wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10 NLT)

Death for Fornication

A priest's daughter who loses her honor by committing fornication and thereby dishonors her father also, shall be burned to death. (Leviticus 21:9 NAB)

Death to Followers of Other Religions

Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed. (Exodus 22:19 NAB)

Kill Nonbelievers

They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB)

Correct, though my bible translates Lev21:9 as 'burned' not 'burned to death'.

However, these commands were given to the nation of Israel as internal laws - they applied to the Jews, not everybody else - the verse you quote in 2Chronicles for example.

And as for other religions - at that time in the area of Israel the other religions were largely various forms of Ba'al worship, some of which involved sacrificing their firstborn sons in a fire. You can appreciate why God didn't want it catching on.


Christians are not held to the letter of the laws given to Moses, though Jesus did reaffirm several of them that still apply.

 

[spacecat]

Your too ignorant to talk to it's because you are trapped in your irrational belief system

No matter what argument was put forward you would deny it because it challenges your faith which has closed your mind

no doubt when things go wrong u happily use the advances in science and tecnology invented by our EVOLVED brains

 

[zanwan]

Your too ignorant to talk to it's because you are trapped in your irrational belief system

No matter what argument was put forward you would deny it because it challenges your faith which has closed your mind

no doubt when things go wrong u happily use the advances in science and tecnology invented by our EVOLVED brains

hmm so you clearly dont like being challenged? I challenge your views and this is the best you can come out with?

Islam actually promotes science and technology. Islamic scholars and scientists early works have had a massive impact on the modern world we have today, from maths to medicine, even the numbers you use are arabic.

Science and Technology is not something Islam or muslims fear, its something we embrace with open arms.

 

[LastMagicBean]

Dude can you please, please please NOT quote the Quran totally out of context please? The verses your referring to were in regards to a war between Muslims and Non-Muslims in the Meccan era.

It matters not a jot what context it was originally used in.

My comment was based on the fact you were fundamentally wrong in your answer to another member of this forum.

The quotes DO exist as you will know. So the answer should have been YES.
Simple as that.

 

[spacecat]

But choose to ignore the bits you don't like when it challenges your belief system
Kind of hypocritical really

The theory of evolution is generally regarded as the greatest scientific and intellectual human achievement...but hey lets just forget that ..


Enjoy your fairytales

 

[cajar]

Ask yourself, why are the eyes at the front of our heads and not at the back, why do our ears have lobes to catch the sound and channel into into our ear, why to we have fingers at the end of our arms to help us grip things and not on our elbows? Why do we have teeth in our mouth? to help us chew. Why do we have a bum hole? To help us excrete waste from the body. Why do we have strong sexual urges and feel intense feelings of pleasure when we have sex? To encourage us to have sex and therefore recreate life.

The human body is the perfect design, yet you say it created itself?!

If you look around you, you must notice that people are different. Different hair, eye colour, face shape, even though they carry traits from their parents. You are observing mutations in the genetic information passed from parent to child.

Notice what happens when a lion chases a herd of prey animals - one gets caught and eaten. Some animals will be better than others at surviving - their genetic mutations are allowed to carry on. You are observing natural selection.

Animals with forward facing eyes have better depth perception than side mounted eyes, hands in the right place allow us to eat and protect ourselves.

Our eyes are at the front of our head not because someone designed them to go there, but because natural selection pushed our species to evolve like that.

The human body is the product of a very long peroid of evolution, certainly not perfect, and certainly not the product of an invisible man in the sky.

 

[Space cat]

I would be very upset if they chose this life, but what can i do?

That's my italics and a very reasonable answer.

 

[Susiejb]

Why are you all having a go at this guy because of his religion or because he is religious?
Isnt it better to accept the fact that someone does believe in god and live and let live?

Yes at least IronNaz has come into this discussion, and whatever our views we should respect his belief and question but not be abusive about it.
All religion has discrepancies that can be pointed out by taking single verses out of context....as IronNaz has just pointed out about the bible.
I know that to people who do practice a faith it is a very precious thing to them and we should remember that.