Not disagreeing with you but it strikes me that if a lot of the people currently arguing about this issue hadn't brought german cars and filled their Italian fridges with French wine and cheese we wouldn't be having this discussion about trade.
Trade with EU
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Not disagreeing with you but it strikes me that if a lot of the people currently arguing about this issue hadn't brought german cars and filled their Italian fridges with French wine and cheese we wouldn't be having this discussion about trade.
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Lola, let's have a look at ERF Trucks.. Good tough trucks that were very cost effective. Bought by MAN in Germany, a new model was hashed together using MAN components rather than the buyer being able to spec their own truck.. Produced for a short while then closed down, leaving a lot of guys in Sandbach unemployed... MAN then got their own trucks in to the ERF dealers and cleaned up. Guess what? Paccar/DAF did exactly the same with Foden. Both makes sold well and were popular with hauliers as they were cheap to run and easy to maintain.. Guess who the army has to buy their trucks from now? British workers getting shafted every time
Yes and that highlights a worry that all this talk of our own sovereignty and running of our own country rings a bit hollow . We ( the public we) could be handing control back to those who in reality are completely unconcerned with sovereignty but totally concerned with returns on their assets.
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[QUOTE= Obviously our disassociation with EU does not prevent the EU's ability to export to us. It does very seriously affect our ability to export to EU!
That also includes financial services between UK and EU.
[/QUOTE
Are you suggesting we would gladly continue to import German goods into the UK whilst EU blocks our exports? I don't think so!! The protection of EU jobs will be a major driving force to formalise trade agreements. As for timings? How long could BMW, VW etc hold off 1000s of redundancies? Not long I would suggest. That would be the driver, not complex 'agreement processes' and 'Brussels red tape'.
Before David Cameron went on his tour of EU to discuss 'UK's case for special status', it was suggested that 'treaty change' would take several years of negotiation. He's now apparently achieved a 'legally binding' agreement with all 28 states which will be formalised at the next treaty change. He achieved that in a matter of weeks because the EU realise that they will be stuffed if UK opts out. Likewise with trade agreements they will do what is necessary to maintain jobs.
That also includes financial services between UK and EU.
[/QUOTE
Are you suggesting we would gladly continue to import German goods into the UK whilst EU blocks our exports? I don't think so!! The protection of EU jobs will be a major driving force to formalise trade agreements. As for timings? How long could BMW, VW etc hold off 1000s of redundancies? Not long I would suggest. That would be the driver, not complex 'agreement processes' and 'Brussels red tape'.
Before David Cameron went on his tour of EU to discuss 'UK's case for special status', it was suggested that 'treaty change' would take several years of negotiation. He's now apparently achieved a 'legally binding' agreement with all 28 states which will be formalised at the next treaty change. He achieved that in a matter of weeks because the EU realise that they will be stuffed if UK opts out. Likewise with trade agreements they will do what is necessary to maintain jobs.
UK financial services "exports" are greater than the whole of our manufacturing industry.
Quite likely EU clients will continue to use the City, as long as the UK obeys all relevant EU regulations. Of course, these regulations, in the event of UK leaving, would be without the UK having a vote or influence on the shape of those regulations. They might, for example, include the Financial Transactions Tax, with the UK has hitherto, as a major EU member with the worlds biggest Financial Services centre, been able to block.
But hey, we can replace European clients by increasing our presence in, er, er, Nigeria and Russia.
Quite likely EU clients will continue to use the City, as long as the UK obeys all relevant EU regulations. Of course, these regulations, in the event of UK leaving, would be without the UK having a vote or influence on the shape of those regulations. They might, for example, include the Financial Transactions Tax, with the UK has hitherto, as a major EU member with the worlds biggest Financial Services centre, been able to block.
But hey, we can replace European clients by increasing our presence in, er, er, Nigeria and Russia.
As you will see from the graph, it was last year; not 2010 or 10 years ago.
I suspect; whatever the result of the referendum the pound will bounce back and a lot of
D
Doggit
Quite simply, if we leave the EU, the french will be angry, and try and f**k us, and if we stay in the Eu, they will know we've got no balls, and will continue to f**k us as they always do, so we're f****d, whichever way we turn.
The basic problem is that the EU doesn't work, and can never work, because it's trying to make 28 completely different countries all work in the same manner.
Politicians don't know how to actually make a country prosper because they are control freaks, not businessmen. And Angela Merkel has actually hastened the death of the EU by inviting uncontrolled migration, and if we stay in it, we will get dragged down with the sinking ship.
Renegotiation of the trade treaties will take time, and the EU will happily put every block in our way, in order to punish us, but it will force us to look elsewhere to trade, so when the EU does collapse, we won't be so badly affected by it's demise.
I'd love to know what Cameron has been promised by the EU, if he stabs us in the back.
The basic problem is that the EU doesn't work, and can never work, because it's trying to make 28 completely different countries all work in the same manner.
Politicians don't know how to actually make a country prosper because they are control freaks, not businessmen. And Angela Merkel has actually hastened the death of the EU by inviting uncontrolled migration, and if we stay in it, we will get dragged down with the sinking ship.
Renegotiation of the trade treaties will take time, and the EU will happily put every block in our way, in order to punish us, but it will force us to look elsewhere to trade, so when the EU does collapse, we won't be so badly affected by it's demise.
I'd love to know what Cameron has been promised by the EU, if he stabs us in the back.
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Perhaps Lola but it is the job of all of us to ensure that this doesn't happen and if we do, then it is our own fault for being lazy but at least we can reverse the stupidity of our own politicos.. If we allow the EU to make our decisions for us, then the only way back could well be by civil unrest.
But just how do we ensure that it doesn't happen? We're talking about a simple transfer of power from Brussels to Westminster . That in itself I don't disagree with but we could just be swopping one form of government for something very similar albeit with less foreign languages , the same old same old .
Thing is I don't view this issue with the rosy tinted glasses of some on both sides , I don't see it as a grass is greener answer , more of a fire or frying pan .I can see problems both ways .
One thing that does amuse me is the rise of the right wing across Europe and people's reaction here. Understandable really. It probably wouldn't be incorrect to say that a lot of the outers here are generally right wing ( not all of course , on balance I've said I'd vote out but tend to lean more to the political left) . I could see there is a possibility that we leave the EU , right wing parties come into power on the continent , our economy slumps a bit and we elect a socialist government.
Thing is I don't view this issue with the rosy tinted glasses of some on both sides , I don't see it as a grass is greener answer , more of a fire or frying pan .I can see problems both ways .
One thing that does amuse me is the rise of the right wing across Europe and people's reaction here. Understandable really. It probably wouldn't be incorrect to say that a lot of the outers here are generally right wing ( not all of course , on balance I've said I'd vote out but tend to lean more to the political left) . I could see there is a possibility that we leave the EU , right wing parties come into power on the continent , our economy slumps a bit and we elect a socialist government.
That's a fair comment EFLI, but only as far as the Euro goes. I was referring to the pound against a range of currencies.
With the Euro, prior to 2008 (The Banking Collapse) the Pound was at around 1.43 to the Euro. (I remember it around 1.6) 2008 was the record low for the GBP -Euro. We're not far off that position again, and at the time of writing yesterday it had fallen about 3% in the same number of days. Today it's rallied by a whopping 0.2%
Prior to 2008 the GPB - USD was around 1.98. Now it's around 1.4
2008 GBP - Yen was around 1.2 and near a record low. Now it's around 1.5 and dropping.
All this is on the uncertainty of a Bexit, never mind a definite decision.
Of course the Euro would probably also suffer if the UK decided to Brexit, but I doubt it would fall as far or as fast as the pound.
It's not just my view:
http://www.financemagnates.com/forex/bloggers/sterling-slumps-as-brexit-concerns-remain/
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The Brexit bunch are telling us, "No worries, we'll just trade elsewhere."
But our trade is already struggling and we have the advantage of the freedom of movement of goods, services and capital within the EU (and EFTA)
Note the 'services" bit, which John has already mentioned. It's our major redeeming factor currently.
But our trade is already struggling and we have the advantage of the freedom of movement of goods, services and capital within the EU (and EFTA)
Note the 'services" bit, which John has already mentioned. It's our major redeeming factor currently.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-35530340
Additionally, PBC, we haven't explored the possibility of EU using artificial barriers to stop UK companies competing with EU companies
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