Intermediate switch, which contacts are switched

[ebee]

Frodo, it seems that you are more knowledgeable than I on these matters, thanks for the info

 

[FrodoOne]

Frodo, it seems that you are more knowledgeable than I on these matters, thanks for the info

Thank you.
However, it is just a case of "Seek and ye shall find."

Many US Citizens appear to think that the US changed Imperial measures to US Customary - for some reason -
little knowing that they are just the Pre-Revolutionary BRITISH measures.

On a somewhat related topic,
did you know that the Metric System (now SI) was invented in England, (in 1668)
although, over 100 years later, it was developed by the French?

See

and

 

[ashtons99]

Thanks fellas so if I want to abandon one of the 2 way switches and replace the intermediate with a 2 way all the wires will be there it’s just a matter of identifying the right switching wires coming from the other switch and finding the common going into the intermediate

 

[EFLImpudence]

it’s just a matter of identifying the right switching wires coming from the other switch

They will be the two wires at one end (top or bottom) of the intermediate switch.

and finding the common going into the intermediate

The common will be one of the wires (in the same cable as the above two) NOT connected to the intermediate switch.
It will be connected to the COM of the new switch.

 

[AndyPRK]

you don’t have to do anything at the intermediate if you don’t wish to.

Just remove the other switch you want and connect com to one of the other wires

 

[FrodoOne]

if I want to abandon one of the 2 way switches and replace the intermediate with a 2 way all the wires will be there it’s just a matter of identifying the right switching wires coming from the other switch and finding the common going into the intermediate

The First Diagram illustrates a probable existing switching arrangement.

You could just remove the First (or Last) 2-Way switch and leave the Intermediate switch acting as a 2-way (Second Diagram)
If you wish to move one 2-Way switch (and remove the Intermediate switch), the wiring will be as shown in the Third Diagram.


(In either case, one unused conductor will remain.
This should be labeled as such
(and, terminated properly),
for future reference to yourself
and
to others who may come after you.)

 

[SUNRAY]

Has any attempt been made to establish how it's currently wired?

 

[ebee]

Has any attempt been made to establish how it's currently wired?

Yes that would be a starter.
If you are removing an intermediate switch and using a two way at that position you might need toa establish that the COM is present in the switchbox, it often is, however it might not actually be there, if its a ganged switch then just by putting reliable joints into the "strappers" then the end "two ways" elsewhere will work as if the removed intermediate is still there and in just one or the other switched positions - if not a ganged switched then you`d just replace the intermediate switch with a blanking plate after making the joints.

 

[SUNRAY]

Before offering advice can we have pics of the other 2 switches wiring, clearly indicating which one you wish to keep and which to 'abandon' and do you have any test kit to identify the cables at the intermediate.

Yes that would be a starter...

 

[AndyPRK]

you don’t have to do anything at the intermediate if you don’t wish to.

Just remove the other switch you want and connect com to one of the other wires

To do the minimum amount of work, and to avoid "messing things up" all you need to do is go to the switch you wish to remove and join some wires. A photo of this switch would be useful, so we can be sure you will get it right first time.

The intermediate switch can stay as it is.

This will also avoid buying switches, trying to match existing switches, etc.

 

[SUNRAY]

To do the minimum amount of work, and to avoid "messing things up" all you need to do is go to the switch you wish to remove and join some wires. A photo of this switch would be useful, so we can be sure you will get it right first time.

The intermediate switch can stay as it is.

This will also avoid buying switches, trying to match existing switches, etc.

Correct but it may not be the nicest way of doing the job.

 

[ashtons99]

To do the minimum amount of work, and to avoid "messing things up" all you need to do is go to the switch you wish to remove and join some wires. A photo of this switch would be useful, so we can be sure you will get it right first time.

The intermediate switch can stay as it is.

This will also avoid buying switches, trying to match existing switches, etc.

Unfortunately all this has come about as we are swapping the switch style from white plastic to G&H antique brass, they don’t do an intermediate in the style we want. The lounge has 3 switches for the light, a 2 gang ( 2 way) at one entrance, a 2 gang (with intermediate) at the bottom of the stairs and a 3 gang ( 2 way) at another entrance, we don’t use the switch in the 3 gang so I’m looking to do away with that. The house is 2 yrs old so wiring is up to date.

I will take photos of the rear of the other 2 switches to help but because of the switch style options I will have to swap the intermediate for a 2 way

 

[FrodoOne]

Unfortunately all this has come about as we are swapping the switch style from white plastic to G&H antique brass, they don’t do an intermediate in the style we want.

However, they do make Intermediate Switches and fit them to Wall-Plates of several antique brass styles.

e. g.
https://gandhelectrical.co.uk/products/finishes/brass/antique-brass/victorian?type=switch
https://gandhelectrical.co.uk/products/finishes/brass/antique-brass/contour

Have you asked if they will make you a Special Order?
(While many switches and plates are In Stock
some have a Lead-Time of 8 working days,
so they must put these together - as required.)

Otherwise, would it not be possible (at extra expense) to obtain an Intermediate Switch in another antique brass plate
and
swap it for the Normal (2-Way) switch in a plate of the style that you want?

 

[SUNRAY]

Unfortunately all this has come about as we are swapping the switch style from white plastic to G&H antique brass, they don’t do an intermediate in the style we want. The lounge has 3 switches for the light, a 2 gang ( 2 way) at one entrance, a 2 gang (with intermediate) at the bottom of the stairs and a 3 gang ( 2 way) at another entrance, we don’t use the switch in the 3 gang so I’m looking to do away with that. The house is 2 yrs old so wiring is up to date.

I will take photos of the rear of the other 2 switches to help but because of the switch style options I will have to swap the intermediate for a 2 way

They do have grid switches in the range

 

[ebee]

Hmm,
should you reconsider the brand the does produce a ready make quite common configuration? food for thought.
Is it part on manufacturing race to the bottom on price cutting that might encourage other manufacturers to follow suit.
don`t get me wrong, I`m all for competitive pricing both individually or as a whole but there is a limit to choice involved that should be deterred.
One common example is - how many manufacturers produce 2 Gang Intermediate switches in their common ranges? Do any manufacturers produce a 3 Gang Intermediate or make either the 2 Gang Int Switch or the 3 Gang variant possible via a Grid Switch type arrangement alternative that could be a near enough match in any of their ranges.
One day we might even find it is common that all everyday standard ranges are completely of INT switches there capable of being used as a direct replacement for 1way, 2way , int in the 1,2,3,4,6 gang versions at least and still have common spacings close matches to what is quite common now, they might then decide there is no longer a need to produce 1 or 2 way switches at all as the Int switch covers them adequately.
Just thought!