8 squid congestion charge
- Thread starter loublou
- Start date
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You think londinium is bad well bristol has more cars per head of population than anywhere else in the country on roads which were designed for horses and carts 100 years ago. I work in the city centre and it is a nightmare. 3 miles from my house and it takes over an hour on the bus.
jasy said:
London is not bad, providing you don't need to move anything but yourself and maybe a briefcase about.
I know there are far worse places for public transport than london. Trouble is it is not, and never can be, just about public transport. People have work to do and things they need to do their work. So long as the agenda is set by public transport for public transport it is going to get harder and more expensive to run a business.
Anyone who thought the charge would stay at £5 was living in cloud cuckoo land, (that's the first one I've heard this year) and it was bound to turn our to be a very handy way to raise funds.
B
Big_Spark
jasy said:Move
Is that supposed to be funny...If you think it is, then your wrong.
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Congestion is bad because it means no-one gets where they are going. The logical solution would be to exclude all traffic except that which needs to be there (as they do in many town centres across the country, limiting traffic to buses and any vehicles that might be there because someone is fixing the pavement, perhaps). But how do you define a need to be there?
Jim has pointed out that he needs to cart around up to 1500kg of stuff to do his job. I don't even need a briefcase to carry around my work 99% of the time!
So, logic dictates his need to use the road is greater than mine, he gets a permit, I get the bus. Easy, isn't it? Problem solved!
However we are not Vulcans, we are selfish illogical people. So, we then see it as a matter of "fairness". I pay loads in road tax and fuel duty, I "deserve" to drive my car on the road. I also don't think it is "fair" that I should be denied the luxury of leaving when I want, having a comfy seat in my own space, not having to put up with yobs etc. etc.
I think it is clear what the solution is... Jeremy Clarkson for Mayor!
Jim has pointed out that he needs to cart around up to 1500kg of stuff to do his job. I don't even need a briefcase to carry around my work 99% of the time!
So, logic dictates his need to use the road is greater than mine, he gets a permit, I get the bus. Easy, isn't it? Problem solved!
However we are not Vulcans, we are selfish illogical people. So, we then see it as a matter of "fairness". I pay loads in road tax and fuel duty, I "deserve" to drive my car on the road. I also don't think it is "fair" that I should be denied the luxury of leaving when I want, having a comfy seat in my own space, not having to put up with yobs etc. etc.
I think it is clear what the solution is... Jeremy Clarkson for Mayor!
B
Big_Spark
AdamW said:I think it is clear what the solution is... Jeremy Clarkson for Mayor!
It may not solve congestion problems, but you can guarantee caravans would become illegal!!
The real problem is exactly what Adam has highlighted, selfish people thinking that public Transport is beneath them and that the only way to get anywhere is by car...
Personally I would ban all private cars from the roads inside the M25 during the hours of 6am and 7pm. This may seem draconian, but 99.99% of people are simply lazy, they do not need to drive. Those that have genuine reasons for driving should be GIVEN a permit to allow use of the vehicle. Taking brat to school would not be a genuine reason, unless that child were disabled.
If you removed all traffice from Londons roads that was not a commercial or necessary vehicle, you would reduce it by at least 75%.
This would not work in rural areas as Public transport here is abismal and locals would not be able to operate without a vehicle, so such a scheme could only be introduced in major conurbations and city centres.
Jasy, I agree with your comments about Bristol..it is bad...but not quite as bad as London.
FWL_Engineer said:jasy said:Move
Is that supposed to be funny...If you think it is, then your wrong.
No i was being serious . You talk alot but dont seem to want to do anything about it. I lived in Victoria for 5 years so i know what london is like you moan about the 25 but drive around brum in the morning and that is twice as bad. It is bad everywhere but at least londinium has the tube to help the commuter. The rest of us have to suffer
FWL_Engineer said:
People drive on the 25 to get around london. This is not laziness but a necessity. All the public transport goes through it mainly, maybe it would be better if we all walked the 30 miles to work just so Mr engineer can have a lie in and get to work without being behind anyone else. Dear oh dear
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moderator
jasy, please note 10a
B
Big_Spark
Jasy, your talking s**t. I have not mentioned the M25 at all. Personally I don't have an issue with the traffic on it..people exagerate it and tend to focus on the one bad stretch from Kent into Surrey and the second bad piece as you approach the M4..other thanh that it is fine if people avoid crash testing their cars!
And further to your comment about moving...I don't live in London, I commute into the city.
In future, If you wish to make comments I suggest you get your facts right instead of making wild statements that lack facts.
And further to your comment about moving...I don't live in London, I commute into the city.
In future, If you wish to make comments I suggest you get your facts right instead of making wild statements that lack facts.
FWL_Engineer said:
Ok, wild statements. How the hell would your 'not' wild statement of banning all cars between 0600 to 1900 work??? Anybody else on here think this is muppetry??? and who are you to decide that a child may only go to school with their parents if they are DISABLED!! Hang on a minute. Yes we all know the school run is a pain in the ar*se but walking to school for primary school kids is a big no no these days. Roads to busy and dangerous and there are Mr Jacksons and Jonathan Kings to deal with. The days of 8, 9 and 10 year olds walking home alone are gone. Then you contradict yourself by changing your target area of inside the M25 to 'major conurbations and city centres', a somewhat smaller area than the whole of the inside of the 25 don't you think. Make 'em wild but make 'em believable
B
Big_Spark
Jasy, I used to walk 1.5 miles to school at 5 years old, and I was never approached by a "dirty old man", as they used to be called.
I agree that the roads are dangerous, but you missed the very point I was making. If you remove more than 90% of the traffic on the roads, then the roads won't be dangerous any longer if you actually think about it.
Regarding the likes of MJ and JK, they preyed on those in their home, the danger to children is the random abductor, these are very rare, despite what many believe. The majority of child abuse is perpetrated by those known to the victim personally.
Also, your other comments I will ignore as you seem to simply like calling people Muppets during your ill informed ramblings. Perhaps if you bothered to think about what you wanted to say and considered how objective that point is, then perhaps you would make a more positive contribution to the forum, but then I suppose this observation will generate the usual retort from you.
I agree that the roads are dangerous, but you missed the very point I was making. If you remove more than 90% of the traffic on the roads, then the roads won't be dangerous any longer if you actually think about it.
Regarding the likes of MJ and JK, they preyed on those in their home, the danger to children is the random abductor, these are very rare, despite what many believe. The majority of child abuse is perpetrated by those known to the victim personally.
Also, your other comments I will ignore as you seem to simply like calling people Muppets during your ill informed ramblings. Perhaps if you bothered to think about what you wanted to say and considered how objective that point is, then perhaps you would make a more positive contribution to the forum, but then I suppose this observation will generate the usual retort from you.
D
david and julie
Not to sure about this, congestion slows traffic to a crawl and slower traffic causes less bodily injury in an accident. Hence why we have traffic calming and the police often reduce the motorways to one lane near accidents. It is done to slow us down because slower is seen as safer. Take away 90% of traffic and some idiot will start excessive speeding.
I agree with you about most perverts are known but there are still some who cruise around looking on the off chance too. There are also the muggers after mobiles etc to think about.
The only sensible way of reducing traffic in London is to spread the countries wealth about a bit more instead of the present centralist approach. The olympics are a case in point, Londoners must dread the thought of this stupid none starter. Whereas the Northwest already has most of the facilities available due to holding the commonwealth games.
trouble with calming schemes are that they do slow the traffic up but they can also contribute to driver frustration and make some drivers speed as soon as they leave the controlled area.
There certainly seems to be a heightened awareness of possible child abduction or worse these days whether it is any worse is debatable but i for one will feel uncomfortable for a while when my children first start going out on their own, I myself used to walk from school as a 5 year old about 5 miles even though i was given a thruppenny bit to get the bus home invariably i'd spend it in the sweet shop on the way home I think i had the sense that if approached i would have screamed and run away but as a parent you always have that worry whether your offspring are safe or not.
There certainly seems to be a heightened awareness of possible child abduction or worse these days whether it is any worse is debatable but i for one will feel uncomfortable for a while when my children first start going out on their own, I myself used to walk from school as a 5 year old about 5 miles even though i was given a thruppenny bit to get the bus home invariably i'd spend it in the sweet shop on the way home
I think i had the sense that if approached i would have screamed and run away but as a parent you always have that worry whether your offspring are safe or not.FWL_Engineer said:
Yes you walked in the good old days as we all did. Times change. D&J i agree, removing traffic does not solve the problem it is the way we do it and the alternatives. Mr Engineer i have noticed on here that you are very good at giving your opinion but hate it if someone disagrees with you, that is muppetry my friend
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