Adding pillar support for RSJ

[Ab12]

I have a building in the garden, which was originally a single garage, the brick wall is the original left side wall, the original right side brick wall was knocked down, and the rear original brick wall was then extended and joined with concrete heavy duty blockwork to make it a wider building, then the side wall was built from blockwork

None of this by me

What I want to do is finish this off. The building has a 5.7m span both ways. Therefore I will split the roof with an RSJ to reduce joist lengths and thickness. To sit the RSJ I need a pillar on the brick wall to mirror the concrete block one shown.

Can I use frame cramp wall ties on the brick wall and then use upright positioned blocks to build out a pillar for the RSJ?

Any help taken!

 

[^woody^]

If a pier is required, those ties do not transfer any load to the main wall so are no suitable

 

[Ab12]

If a pier is required, those ties do not transfer any load to the main wall so are no suitable

Any suggestions on alternative?

 

[Deluks]

Any suggestions on alternative?

Steel post? Might have to dig a new pad under it.

 

[Ab12]

Steel post? Might have to dig a new pad under it.

100*100 with a top and bottom plate bolted to concrete foundation and to the single skin wall?

 

[Deluks]

100*100 with a top and bottom plate bolted to concrete foundation and to the single skin wall?

I'm not gonna guess an answer, but to elaborate on your question, what constitutes your foundation?

 

[tony1851]

Why do you need a pier? The beam won't be carrying a particularly high load if its just a flat roof?
You could sit the new steel beam direct on the 1/2 brick wall on either a concrete padstone or a suitable steel spreader plate.
Presumably the end of the steel beam would be covered by a fascia board?
Building a pier would involve tying it effectively to the existing wall - not easy - and forming a pad foundation at the same level as the existing foundation.

 

[Ab12]

The beam I've been told to use is a 203 203 UC 46, based on the 5.8m span. That's quite heavy no? Surely the single skin wall could just collapse with the weight of that plus roof
End of beam would be covered with fascia yes.

 

[stevie888]

You really need whoever has specced the beam to finish the job. Would seem rather a beefy beam though.

 

[Ab12]

You really need whoever has specced the beam to finish the job. Would seem rather a beefy beam though.

That's what I thought, this was all handed to me by the previous owners. Out of curiosity what would be a better size?

It's a simple flat cold roof.

 

[^woody^]

Any suggestions on alternative?

Whoever designed the beam should be designing the pier - if a pier is actually needed, and also be designing any step out in the foundation to accommodate the loading from any new pier. And there would normally be a padstone, again type and size (or alternative) would be designed.

If you have the design documents , it should have the designers contact details and you could ask them to complete the design or to redesign the beam - as yes, a UC of that section does seem OTT - more of a "we used this one on the last job" guess rather than a proper calculation.

If you was given this and there are no proper design calculations, then you may want to get your own done and see what alternative options there are. Bear in mind that whoever produced the design for that beam has no contractual or other duty to you, if it is unsuitable or fails.

 

[stevie888]

As I can't work up enthusiam to dig out my old laptop to access Superbeam I can't answer accurately but I would guess at a 203 UB which is available in 102 & 133 widths and a variety of weights

 

[Ab12]

As I can't work up enthusiam to dig out my old laptop to access Superbeam I can't answer accurately but I would guess at a 203 UB which is available in 102 & 133 widths and a variety of weights

Thanks all, Stevie are you an SE? Perhaps we could engage?

 

[Dereekoo]

Working on a roof load of 2kn/m2 a 6m joist bending moment would be 27knm. Looking at Blue Book a 203 x 102 x 23 would seem to suffice (subject to a shear and deflection check) Perhaps Tony1851 can concur

 

[Ab12]

Working on a roof load of 2kn/m2 a 6m joist bending moment would be 27knm. Looking at Blue Book a 203 x 102 x 23 would seem to suffice (subject to a shear and deflection check) Perhaps Tony1851 can concur

Thanks for this!
I assume if this is concurred this is fine for both the midpoint joist support of the roof and the garage door opening?

The "documents" I have don't have any details on them, they are handwritten copies of something, but there is an assumption of a 1.5-1.8kn/m² design load.

That still leaves open the question of what kind of supports are needed. I was thinking of getting double brick pillars toothed into the single skin wall where needed..