Boiler Nightmare continues

[flutterbye]

Hi

Sorry to open up 3 threads in 2 days I'll try and keep everything to this thread. We are living a nightmare and I have taken previous advice (we need to upgrade our boiler due to it checking out CO!)
We had another "engineer" arrive today to quote for a new boiler and upgrade to fully pumped CH. Turns out he is not GasSafe but his colleagues are. I got his number after ringing people locally on the gas register website (but the guy who is registered sent his colleague round instead).
Anyway despite me showing him only the CH, he says our recently installed gas cooker (connected by a corgi about a year ago) and said that it needs an isolating valve visible or in a cupboard. There is one but it’s behind the electric cooker. From reading other threads here, I think that is fine and he is drumming up work for himself but I'm worried that I never wanted him to even look at the cooker. If he had found it contrary to regs could he have capped it off even though we invited him to our house for a quote only?

His second observation was that the gas pipe is "small" (it’s 15mm) and that it appears to come out of the wall below the boiler. He said the pipe was set in concrete, could rust and would need to be ripped out and replaced. Is that true? I don’t know whether or not it’s set in concrete – it’s also about 1M from the gas supply in our integral garage.

 

[Steady]

Don't worry about the gas cooker -he probably only mentioned it in passing to impress you with his vast knowledge of gas work depite not being registered.

If you are having a new boiler installed though, it is fairly certain you will need a 22mm gas supply at least and yes, he is correct, gas pipes should not be 'buried' in solid walls. If that is in fact the case with yours.

It probably comes through the wall from the garage so it would not be a big job to redo it in 22mm and sleeve it the correct way through the wall.

 

[gas4you]

Nobody apart from National Grid have the power to disconnect anything without your permission.

All we can do as Gas Safe engineers is advise you to have it disconnected if unsafe and do so with your permission.

If an appliance was unsafe and you refused to have it disconnected, the Gas Safe engineer would get you to sign the warning notice that you had refused permission, then go out to his van and call National Grid to report it. They would then come along and disconnect and also have the power to break in to reach the gas meter if it was that serious or they were presented with a really awkward customer.

Look for another engineer who is Gas Safe in his own right.

One has to wonder why, if this chap knows so much, that he isn't registered in his own right

 

[keego]

If you are having a new boiler installed though, it is fairly certain you will need a 22mm gas supply at least and yes, he is correct, gas pipes should not be 'buried' in solid walls.

Not if it's a heat only boiler as the OP says they are having the system converted to fully pumped so a 15mm supply is adequate for most boilers except the Worcester Ri range. As for the pipe being buried in the wall then as long as it's not a lead pipe it should be OK to use although it's not ideal, if the meter is only 1m away I would be taking the feed from there.

 

[Steady]

Am well aware that some heat only boilers require only 15mm gas supply.
Only problem is I don't think the OP really knows WHAT they are getting as they are clearly a little confused when they say: 'We had another "engineer" arrive today to quote for a new boiler and upgrade to fully pumped CH'

As we know the CH is already 'fully pumped'. It's the hot water that needs upgrading and suitable controls. Not many people bother with this 'extra' work these days. Most are influenced by price and prefer the combi option. In which case,given the OP's lack of knowledge of these things it needed poiting out that a 22mm gas supply is a recommended upgrade.
You wouldn't keep with that gnarly old bit of 15mm copper in your house now, would yer?

 

[kevindgas]

We had another "engineer" arrive today to quote for a new boiler and upgrade to fully pumped CH. Turns out he is not GasSafe but his colleagues are.

therefore he is not qualified to assess you requirements as he is NOT COMPETENT

show anyone who is not Gassafe Registered the door immediately.

as for the "cooker" do you mean a hob in a worktop or a freestanding cooker
if it is a hob then ideally it should have an accessable isolator NOT an immediately accessable isolator as you can turn off at the meter in an emergency
so an isolator behind an oven is acceptable although ideally it should be easily accessable.
but if its a free standing cooker then all it needs is a bayonet fitting.

 

[ChrisR]

A hob isolator doesn't have to be in a particular place, it's only for "isolation for maintenance". They're usually behind a cooker, not a problem.
No real problem with someone having a look, and he would possibly be OK to do the job if he was "under supervision" - though there's no definitiion of that.
Sure you'd usually change a 15mm gas pipe even if quite short, especially as there's a hob as well. It depends though - we can't really tell from here.
Always get a couple of quotes though, preferably at least one from someone recommended.
You could call BG for a laugh...

 

[ollski]

We had another "engineer" arrive today to quote for a new boiler and upgrade to fully pumped CH. Turns out he is not GasSafe but his colleagues are.

therefore he is not qualified to assess you requirements as he is NOT COMPETENT

show anyone who is not Gassafe Registered the door immediately.

as for the "cooker" do you mean a hob in a worktop or a freestanding cooker
if it is a hob then ideally it should have an accessable isolator NOT an immediately accessable isolator as you can turn off at the meter in an emergency
so an isolator behind an oven is acceptable although ideally it should be easily accessable.
but if its a free standing cooker then all it needs is a bayonet fitting.

I'm not aware of any major national installer who use gas safe registered engineers to do quotes.

 

[flutterbye]

Firstly, thanks v much to you all for all the replies.

With regard to the "upgrade to fully pumped", I did mean of course only the water is currently gravity based. In that case I presume a MV would be needed and a hotwater tank replacement (?) beause it has no thermostat of its own.

I hadn't considered a combi - would that work out cheaper? Only downside is that the shower is currently pump assisted out of the HW tank.

 

[Steady]

Your hot water cyclinder is probably quite old if it runs off gravity circs. It is likely you would need a new one with a coil suitable for pumped hot water. You would also need: zone valve(s) and a cylinder stat as well as all the other controls wiring in, which is not a five minute job.
This would increase the cost of the job quite a lot obviously but some prefer this set-up to a combi( me included).
The combi though will provide a showering experience probably superior to your current one with the added advantage that you/it will never run out of hot water.Can't say the same about your current set-up.
Then again, if you ignored the combi option and went for a cylinder with an immersion you could still have a shower if your boiler broke down.
Though you probably knew all this...

 

[fitz1]

where do u live. one of the guys on here maybe able to quote.

 

[flutterbye]

In Egham. Please feel free to PM me if you're on Gas Safe register and are close.

Only quote so far is £2,150 + VAT