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Dual Channel (hot water and heating) Hive to Combi - Vitodens 100-w - Viessmann

Discussion in 'Plumbing and Central Heating' started by Sam4diy, 10 Dec 2018.

  1. Sam4diy

    Sam4diy

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    Hi all,
    I have Vitodens 100-w and its combi boiler. But, I have got hot water and heating version of hive. Main supply lines were coming directly to old thermostat and then were going to boiler main supply, I have kept it same in the diagram below.

    Please guide:
    Where to connect 1 and L from boiler to hive?

    Thanking in anticipation

    upload_2018-12-10_23-52-12.png

    Boiler:
    upload_2018-12-10_23-52-59.png
    Hive:
    upload_2018-12-10_23-53-32.png
     
    Last edited: 11 Dec 2018
  2. stem

    stem

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    OK so you have a Combi boiler. They don't normally have a separate hot water cylinder, which the dual channel Hive is designed for. So, either.

    1) You don't have a hot water cylinder and have purchased a dual channel version by mistake, or
    2) You do have a hot water cylinder connected to your combi, in which case the Hive won't be wired directly to the boiler, it will replace the existing programmer.

    I'm assuming because you don't mention a hot water cylinder, or programmer that 1) is the correct scenario. If it's 2) then please post back as the instructions below will be incorrect.

    First of all, I need to point out that if you have to remove a room sealed enclosure to gain access your boilers wiring terminals (some you do, some you don't, and unfortunately I don't know which category yours is) then it is not a DIY job. It should be done by a Gas Safe engineer who can make sure that it is correctly sealed up again afterwards.

    You really have the wrong version of Hive. The Single Channel version is better suited to a combi. Some combi's can't be connected to a Dual Channel version because they only have 24V thermostat circuits and the Dual Channel can only provide 230V control.

    However, your boiler does have 230V control, so the Dual Channel can be fitted, however the hot water functions whist present at the Hive, won't actually do anything. So personally, if it were me, I would exchange it for the Single Channel version, that doesn't include the separate hot water control.

    Capture.JPG

    The 230V supply for the Hive (N) & (L) comes from the boiler (N) & (L) terminals included in the group marked with the 'F'

    Hive terminal (4) 'Heating on' connects to the terminal marked (1) included in the boiler terminals marked with the 'F'

    I assume by "external switch" you are referring to the existing room thermostat, that should be disconnected. The jumper 'D' is not required and will have already been removed when the existing external controls were added.
     
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  3. muggles

    muggles

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    Such a shame to connect such a crap stat to an advanced boiler :( your boiler is OpenTherm compatible, which both vastly simplifies the wiring and also improves efficiency when connected to an OpenTherm stat such as Honeywell T6 or Nest
     
  4. Sam4diy

    Sam4diy

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    Thanks for the suggestion but this is what it is. I have Hive gifted and want to save money and use it.
     
  5. Sam4diy

    Sam4diy

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    Thanks for detailed reply. 1) is correct scenario for me i.e. combi boiler without hot water cylinder and got hive as gift (so exchanging Hive is not an option)

    Boiler is “Vissemann, Vitodens 100-w, WB1C 26 kw – combi boiler”

    To access boiler wiring terminals, I just have to open front panel attached with two screws. The panel is not sealed and just have soft pads on the edges.

    Yes, existing thermostat is been removed so the jumper ‘D’.

    I am not home so will update when complete the wiring

    Thanks again

    Different but related question:

    upload_2018-12-11_11-7-20.png

    This was my old thermostat connection.

    A 5-core cable is coming out of the boiler (I haven’t removed it yet):

    - Brown is connected to L on group E on boiler

    - Blue is connected to N on group E on boiler

    - Yellow is connected to earth on group E on boiler

    - Black is connected to 1 on group F on boiler

    - Grey is connected to L on group F on boiler

    As in the picture, the power to the boiler and the external thermostat is common. Can I power Hive the same way (earth will go on parked terminal on Hive)? If yes then where the black and grey will go on Hive?
     
  6. stem

    stem

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    What make / model is the existing thermostat?

    Whilst the backplate is 'universal' the way they are wired varies from thermostat to thermostat (as you can see if you compare the dual channel hive with the single channel hive)

    Also where does the 5 core cable go? There appear to be two 3 core cables at the thermostat. Where do they go? Is there a junction box somewhere where all of the cables terminate? Earth wires should never be connected to the live backplate terminals of the thermostat, so my guess is that they are not actually connected to earth at the other end.
     
    Last edited: 11 Dec 2018
  7. Sam4diy

    Sam4diy

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    Don’t remember name of the old thermostat and I am not home to confirm, sorry if its inconvenient in anyway. Connections on the old thermostat are like this:

    upload_2018-12-11_11-27-10.png


    So if I power Hive the same way (earth will go on parked terminal on Hive) then do black and grey will go on Hive?
     
  8. Sam4diy

    Sam4diy

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    ...I intend to do it the way I have drawn in the first diagram in the post and don’t know where to connect black and grey on Hive.
     
  9. stem

    stem

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    Thanks, that clarifies the thermostat, but also where does the 5 core cable you refer to go? There appear to be two, 3 core cables at the thermostat, making 6 cores.

    You won't need to use the black wire with the Hive dual channel, if connecting it to the existing thermostat wires connected as you describe.

    EDIT
    Regardless of that, if you can achieve the below using the existing thermostat wires, then you are sorted.

    Drawing1 Model (1).jpg

    The reason the black wire is not used here is because it provides a live, and in the case of the existing thermostat wiring, this has already been connected to the L at group E, so there is no need for a second L from group F.
     
    Last edited: 11 Dec 2018
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  10. Sam4diy

    Sam4diy

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    Was writing the reply to your first question and in the mean time you posted the solution. For benefit of someone in similar situation, I will still answer to your question "where does the 5 core cable you refer to go" and answer is:

    "3-core is main power supply directly coming to old thermostat. 5-core joins from old thermostat and goes into the boiler (taking the lead from old thermostat joints N, L and E) (same as very first hand-rawn diagram above)." Also, in picture it appear to be 6-core but actually it is 5-cofe.

    Response to your final solution:
    Thank you very much, it does make sense. I will update how it goes on completing the installation (which will be a bit late).

    Thanking you before seeing the result for the way you got involved
     
    Last edited: 11 Dec 2018
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  11. Sam4diy

    Sam4diy

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    As promised to update, I have installed as per your instructions and it's all working fine. Big thanks again. Final diagram looks like this:
    upload_2018-12-11_22-36-16.png

    Thanks all
     
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  12. Alexaossssd

    Alexaossssd

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  13. Alexaossssd

    Alexaossssd

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    Hi I am having Viessmann Vitodens 050 w could please me in wiring I am having hive dual channel thermostat. Thanks in advance
     
  14. muggles

    muggles

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    All the answers you require are written above - you only need a single channel not a dual channel, Hive is cr@p and the Honeywell T6 would be a much better option for your boiler, but if you really must persist with having Hive then follow the instructions given
     
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  15. Alexaossssd

    Alexaossssd

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