EICR - please advise

[chocolate.chip]

Hi. we're in a process of buying a house and we received a report which flagged up quite a few issues, two c1s and a few c2 and c3s. Can someone tell me how serious these issues are:
1.no PBC to gasmain
2. no visual PBC to watermain
3. switch fuse below DB in poor condition and wires exposed
4. switch fuse has 60a fuse feeding s/o in kitchen weith no red
5. no ip rated lights above bath and shower
6. no rcd protection to cooker circuit
7. s/o in lounge has reversed polarity
8. switch lincs not tagged
9.poorly installed cabled in meter and boiler cupboard
10. circuit 2 dubious Zs reading
11. ISA MCBs serving ring circuits
Electrician recommended full inspection and possibly a rewire. I am clueless, is it really bad?

 

[winston1]

All easilly fixed without a rewire. No 7 is most important. Sounds like electrician is trying for unnecessary work.

 

[ericmark]

1.no PBC to gasmain
Gas main should not be bonded, only gas pipes within the home should be bonded, there must be an insulator between the two, or a supply fault could rupture gas pipes.
2. no visual PBC to watermain
It is not that hard to actually measure to see if there is good earth bonding on the water, there is no requirement for it to be visual.
3. switch fuse below DB in poor condition and wires exposed
It does not say what type of switch fuse, it could be a fused isolator, or a fused connection unit, and it does not say if copper showing or just the inner insulation, however very little work likely needed to correct.
4. switch fuse has 60a fuse feeding s/o in kitchen weith no red
Not a clue what he is talking about, clearly at 60A a fused isolator not a fused connection unit, but why it should be RED I don't know.
5. no ip rated lights above bath and shower
All items can have an IP rattling, could be IP11 which would be unsatisfactory, but because the label telling you what the rating is has been removed, is no reason to fail anything.
6. no rcd protection to cooker circuit
You don't need RCD protection for hard wired items, this is acceptable.
7. s/o in lounge has reversed polarity
Clearly needs correcting, however rest of EUROPE do not have polarity fixed sockets, the problem in UK is the fuse will be on neutral not line, but 15 minutes to correct.
8. switch lincs not tagged
OK in commercial premises we do stick labels on showing where fed from, but this is domestic, it is simply not done.
9.poorly installed cabled in meter and boiler cupboard
Sure it is, but really it says nothing,
10. circuit 2 dubious Zs reading
So what are the reading? With non RCD protected circuits the fault current needs to be high enough to insure the protective device (fuse or MCB) will open within a set time, there is for every device a pass mark, it either passes or fails, there is no grey area.
11. ISA MCBs serving ring circuits
I am trying to understand why MCB's that comply with the international standards organisation should not be used? The MCB should be marked B, C, or D which tells us together with the rating what Zs reading is required.

It does seem the guy is trying to drum up business. The report reminds me of a chocolate fire guard.
Electrician recommended full inspection and possibly a rewire. I am clueless, is it really bad?[/QUOTE]

 

[JohnW2]

Gas main should not be bonded, only gas pipes within the home should be bonded, there must be an insulator between the two, or a supply fault could rupture gas pipes.

I imagine that they meant "gas pipes within the home" but, nevertheless, could you perhaps clarify/explain your statement?

Even if (contrary to electrical common sense, even if regs-compliant) bonding is undertaken on the consumer side of the meter, there is surely no guarantee that the meter does not provide electrical continuity and/or that an 'insulator' is present in the pipe?

Kind Regards, John

 

[ericmark]

I imagine that they meant "gas pipes within the home" but, nevertheless, could you perhaps clarify/explain your statement?

Even if (contrary to electrical common sense, even if regs-compliant) bonding is undertaken on the consumer side of the meter, there is surely no guarantee that the meter does not provide electrical continuity and/or that an 'insulator' is present in the pipe?

Kind Regards, John

OK I could go down the route explaining TN and TT and where it does, and does not matter.

However the point is the EICR does not tell anyone what has been found when they give just a fraction of what should be reported, so the report is in real terms useless.

The only bit of the report which actually tells one anything is the reverse polarity.

I have seen so many reports where one is left scratching ones head wondering what the other guy thought he has seen. Facts are easy, if the Zs is 1.5 with a TN system with a B32 MCB with no RCD one can with out fear of contridition say it does not comply. But dubious is really not the way to describe what is found.

 

[JohnW2]

OK I could go down the route explaining TN and TT and where it does, and does not matter.

Fair enough, but what I was asking about was your suggestion that allowing bonding (presumably particularly with TN-C-S) to be in electrical continuity with a gas main could result in a supply fault rupturing gas pipes.

As I said, even if that is a theoretical possibility, it surely is a situation which exists in countless installations?

Kind Regards, John

 

[chocolate.chip]

Thank you for all comments and suggestions. I guess I have no option but to send another electrician round and hopefully get a better picture. Fingers crossed rewire isn't needed and all problems can be easily dealt with.

 

[JohnW2]

I guess I have no option but to send another electrician round and hopefully get a better picture.

It seems that is probably the case - there currently seems to be a paucity of detailed information.

Fingers crossed rewire isn't needed and all problems can be easily dealt with.

We obvioulsy cannot predict what another electrician will find/say, but nothing that you've told us so far is, itself, even remotely close to suggesting that a 'complete re-wire' (or anything approaching it) would be necessary.

How old is the house? Do you have any idea when it was last re-wired (or originally wired)? Since there is mention of MCBs and, by implication, an indication that many/most circuits are RCD protected suggests that you probably have a 'relatively modern' (well, probably within ~30 years) consumer unit.

Kind Regards, John

 

[securespark]

Could "ISA" actually be a misread of "15A"?

 

[Risteard]

Could "ISA" actually be a misread of "15A"?

It very obviously is, although I would suspect 16A rather than 15A.

 

[chocolate.chip]

Could "ISA" actually be a misread of "15A"?

haha more than likely I'm sorry. I did say I have no clue

JohnW2 the house was built in 1950s and rewired in 80s

 

[securespark]

Why is it very obvious? And it could well be 15A.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Either way, it's not non-compliant - although it may be just a comment.

Could it be two radials?

 

[Risteard]

Why is it very obvious? And it could well be 15A.

Because it obviously means 16A rather than ISA - context makes it bloody obvious. (It could be 15A, but 16A is more likely.)

 

[Risteard]

Either way, it's not non-compliant

Agreed. It is daft, however, if it is indeed an intact ring.

I often come across 20A and 25A rings and just have to wonder "why"? It demonstrates stupidity of a profound scale.