Extension cables and BS1363

[ericmark]

The old Bakelite plug

had a gap so you could have an earth wire without it coming out at the bottom. Today

the earth strap

does not connect direct to earth, it has a 1 Megohm resistance, just as well with a TN-C-S earth, as loss of PEN could be quite shocking.

There is no need to allow on to open the shutters, putting the plug in wrong way around,

I have questioned fitting sockets upside down,

as if the cable entry faces up, then with some plugs, items could be dropped into the cable aperture, it would not comply with IP rating for hole at the top. One shown designed for a floor box, so not a problem, but

Looking at the "Wall-mountable" bit, would not this mean some sockets are upside down, and the hole for cable for reusable plug would not comply with IP rating?

 

[plugwash]

The Looking at the "Wall-mountable" bit, would not this mean some sockets are upside down,

Indeed, if you wall-mounted it horizontally, half the sockets would be "upside down".

A possible solution to this would be to wall-mount it vertically, so all the plugs are sideways,

and the hole for cable for reusable plug would not comply with IP rating?

Is there a requirement for them to? I presume you are referring to the BS7671 requirement for "top surfaces of enclosures" but does that apply to a plug?

Lots of portable equipment can be placed in any orientation and doesn't meet IP4x on every surface.

 

[securespark]

All true.

However, as far as I am aware (I may be wrong - secure may be able to tell us!) BS1363 has been 'as it is now' (in not having any minimum distance for earth pin to edge of plate) since the very first appearance of BS1363 plugs/sockets - at a time long before what is now the "de-facto standard" for face plates and back boxes had even been thought of. Indeed, in the early days, even MK surface-mounted sockets were such that I suspect a plug could be inserted upside down ....

View attachment 403892

I don't believe it has changed.

WRT that image, there are also Mini Logic sockets, but I never tried putting a plug in upside down in those, they won't open, anyhow.

 

[JohnW2]

I don't believe it has changed.

Thanks. As I said, I was not aware of it ever having changed.

WRT that image, there are also Mini Logic sockets, but I never tried putting a plug in upside down in those, they won't open, anyhow.

Yes, that's already been mentioned - but, as you say, inserting the plug upside down (which looks as if it might well be possible) would not open the shutters of an MK socket.

However, if anyone one else made a socket that size which had earth pin-operated shutters, then there could well be a problem.

 

[JohnW2]

I have questioned fitting sockets upside down, .... as if the cable entry faces up, then with some plugs, items could be dropped into the cable aperture, it would not comply with IP rating for hole at the top.

The plug is not an 'enclosure', nor even part of the electrical installation. Is there actually any requirement for IP rating of a plug?

 

[ericmark]

The plug is not an 'enclosure', nor even part of the electrical installation. Is there actually any requirement for IP rating of a plug?

OK, see your point, in the same way as this has nothing to do with the installation, although it may point to a lack of sockets, but if mounted upside down, clearly there can be a danger as a result. And there is little the user can do to remove the danger, the socket in picture using an adaptor like this

removed the problem of all that weight being supported by the socket.

 

[morqthana]

Crabtree make a similar socket to the MK Mini Logic

Dunno what the shutter arrangement is. Doesn't appear to be sold in the UK.


But if you really want to have fun, just get one of those multi-compatible travel adapters, then you can get no earth-connection, L/N reversal, fuse-free and shutter-free operation all in one handy package!

 

[plugwash]

Dunno what the shutter arrangement is. Doesn't appear to be sold in the UK.

Looks like a basic earth-pin operated shutter to me.

 

[ebee]

Looks like a basic earth-pin operated shutter to me.

Possibly yes.
Dont forget, we very rarely seem to question the bog standard BC Lampholder (and ES etc) having two exposed pins with a relatively short shroud and it could be Live if no lamp onboard, we do not seem to worry toomuch about those! Perhaps we should, I think (only think) that it might have been involved during the electrocution of a young girl in my neck of the woods some years ago - the family were blamming the local council because the house had recently been rewired and eventually we heard from the local press coroners court summary that the fixed wiring was ok and it was due to a table lamp being used in the outside loo, didnt actually make clear if the table lamp itself was faulty.
Of course there were plenty of rumours about the cause back then even though it was all before Fakebook and all the RCDing we have nowadays.

 

[JohnW2]

Dont forget, we very rarely seem to question the bog standard BC Lampholder (and ES etc) having two exposed pins with a relatively short shroud and it could be Live if no lamp onboard, we do not seem to worry toomuch about those!

I'm sure we could find some people who didn't qualify as one of those 'we' ... and it would seem to have the dubious honour of having an IP rating of IP10, certainly when mounted 'pins up' (as in many/most table and standard lamps, and some 'chandelier-like fittings), but possibly, in some cases, IP11 when mounted 'pins down' !

 

[morqthana]

Amazing, isn't it, that our living rooms weren't littered with dead bodies at the bottoms of standard lamps and side tables...