Gas pipe sizing issue

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Evening all

I'm in a real fix and would appreciate some expert advice.

Almost two weeks ago my ~20 year old combi boiler decided to throw its toys out of the pram. Fair enough, I thought, it's finally time to get a replacement. I've had a few different people call and they've all sucked air through their teeth when they see the old boiler's 15mm gas pipe.
I am told that condensing combi boilers require 22mm pipe due to the amount of gas they use on startup. Apparently 15mm may be ok if the meter is close to the boiler but my meter is in the basement and I am in a second floor flat :(
Easy, you say, just run a new 22mm pipe from the meter to the boiler & hob. The thing is, the pipe coming off the meter is 22mm which goes into the concrete floor, across the basement and then up out of the floor and into the breeze block wall. Where it goes after that nobody knows. I have looked all over my flat but I can't see any evidence of 22mm pipe anywhere so I don't think it downsizes in my flat. The floors are all concrete so there's no easy peeking underneath floorboards.

Ordinarily a new pipe would be run from the meter to the flat perhaps out of the basement and up the outside wall and then into my flat (boiler is mounted on an external wall in the bedroom). The only trouble here is that the basement and meters are in the middle of the block and do not face an external wall so there's no way (that I can think of) to get a new pipe from the meter up to my flat and into the hob and boiler.

I am at a standstill with no heat or hot water and no way forward. Does anyone have any suggestions as to what I should do? I was wondering if there were any circumstances where it was permissible to install a non-condensing boiler that presumably would work with a 15mm pipe as the current one does? Similar to when Thames Water visited when I first moved in and insisted on fitting a water meter. Once they realised that the main water pipe had been tiled in by a previous owner they said they would allow me to carry on as is because there was no way to fit a meter without destroying half of the bathroom. Does anything like this exist in the gas world (I'm guessing what the answer is but I'm clutching at straws here).

Thanks for any advice you can offer.
 
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Your gas pipe must be adequate to supply the correct volume of gas at the correct pressure (usually about 20m/bar) to all of your appliances simultaneously. Condensing, non-condensing is irrelevant. Undersized gas pipes are not even allowed on existing installations. Your current boiler may even be at risk.

You have the following choices. Find out what the existing pipe can handle and if possible install a suitable regular boiler and HW cylinder. Re-run gas pipe to correct size for a combi or find a non-gas heating solution.
 
From your description, the initial run of 22mm is under sized too.

There are no easy ways out of it. The pipe must be the right size. If it is too small the boiler will not operate correctly, or safely.

The fact you have one now is irrelevant; nor does it mean it is operating safely.
 
the OP must be in mornington crescent, where a whole building is piped in 15mm...

I guess 20 years ago the system boilers were ripped out and replaced with 18kw combis... which no longer exist..

As Dan says no easy way out...new pipe or different system...

Dont expect much sympathy from installers, We have to comply to regulations..and you would complain if we didn't...
 
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With the length of run you'll need you may well require the start of the run to be in 28mm...
 
Thanks very much for the replies everyone. Certainly seems like I'm between a rock and a hard place. Been glancing at electric boilers over the past few days :(
One plumber has quoted for an Ariston 24 E which he says should be ok with the reduced pipe size. I guess there's no way of knowing until the flow and pressure are measured, but the guy quoting the Ariston has not mentioned this is a requirement or will be done :/

Anyhow, I've got someone from on here coming over next week for their opinion, so I'll have a chat to them about it then.

Thanks again
 
It matters not a shlt whether the boiler "should" be OK. The gas pressure for a given consumption MUST be correct. Hopefully anyone from this site's pro's should know that.... he says scurrying off to see what's booked in :LOL:
 
theres always a chance its suitable for a small system boiler. Say 12kw? with a small UV cylinder. get an electric hob and your good to go.
 
How may kW was your old combi?

Chances are if you can find someone willing. Putting on a combi
if identical kw will work.

(just don't say I told you)

If it's been working fine for the past 20 years!

Alternative is a small kW maybe 12kW boiler and unvented cylinder.
 
After reading your long winded post my advice is to get a gas fitter in to sort it properly. He/she will tell you what it required and the final price will include everything to make that installation suitable to be passed by building control.

Then let them worry about getting the 28mm pipe to your front door before they reduce it accordingly.
 

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